The original product for Anchor was much different than what it became, totally. Take us through the initial idea of it and the evolution of how it became the thing that we know today. Yeah.

So when we first started building Anchor, we wanted to do everything to audio all at once. We were like, man, podcasts are great. But wouldn't it be great if they were easier to make, easier to distribute, easier to monetize? And then as a listener, you know, podcasts are great, but they're long. You know, it's hard to parse through information. They're not interactive. Like we had all these issues we identified with the medium, both on the creation side and the consumption side. And naively, being first-time founders and entrepreneurs, we said, let's try to fix everything all at once. And the implementation of all of those ideas mashed into one thing was basically a social network. It was, hey, let's build a social network in a new format for audio. That's short form. That's interactive. That's easily shareable. It's less dense, so it's easier to get through lots of information really quickly rather than sitting through a 40-minute episode of something. And we got to work building that. And it was cool. I mean, to be honest, when we first launched it, it really resonated with a lot of people. We saw a lot of people wanting to create. But we also immediately identified some pretty big issues with it, which the main one being that even though we could get people to create in this new format, it was effectively like two-minute long audio files that people could respond to with their own voices and they could share, they could put them on Twitter and stuff. Even though it was really easy to get people to create that stuff, the listening experience was not good. It turns out listening to a bunch of short form two-minute clips of audio from people who have never recorded audio before and don't have any tools to make it better is not that enjoyable of a listening experience. So after the initial sort of wave of excitement after the product came out, it pretty much flatlined and usage dropped to zero.