Bogle was a combination of Steve Jobs and Martin Luther, the Protestant guy. He created practical products that revolutionized the industry but on the other hand he created what's essentially a religion. Bogle would just drop bombs on all these things that Vanguard did that they were trying to sell and make money on. The first CEO, Brennan, had a big falling out with Bogle. And so there was this interesting push pull between the two sides for many years.

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