Outro

According to conventional history, the last 12,000 years has seen the steady march of progress from primitive savagery to enlightened civilization.

In the age of Trump, Elon, Bezos, Zuckerberg, Putin, Xi, Orbán, Netanyahu, Erdoğan, and Khamenei, this story can't be true.

Luke Kemp joins me to offer another story, one in which mutual aid is what makes humans special - and what historians call "civilization" is actually the history of domination and coercion.

I cannot recommend the book more highly!

https://flyleafbooks.com/book/9780593321355