
DOS#7 The Fifth Rule – Discernment of Spirits w/ Fr. Timothy Gallagher – Discerning Hearts Podcast
Discernment of Spirits with Fr. Timothy Gallagher - Discerning Hearts Catholic Podcasts
Introduction
Desserningharts.com in cooperation with the oblates of the Virgin Mary presents the Dessermen of Spirits, setting the captives free with Father Timothy Gallagher. Father Gallagher is featured on the EWTN series, Living the Desserning Life, the spiritual teachings of Saint Ignatius of Loyola. In time of desolation, never make a change to any aspect of our spiritual life, he says.

The 14 Rules of the Discernment of Spirits with Fr. Timothy Gallagher with Kris McGregor
Episode Seven: Rule Five – Never Make a Change in Time of Desolation
Episode 7 -The Fifth Rule:
In time of desolation never to make a change; but to be firm and constant in the resolutions and determination in which one was the day preceding such desolation, or in the determination in which he was in the preceding consolation. Because, as in consolation it is rather the good spirit who guides and counsels us, so in desolation it is the bad, with whose counsels we cannot take a course to decide rightly.
Episode Seven of The Discernment of Spirits: Setting the Captives Free focuses on Rule Five, one of the most decisive and practical rules in Ignatian discernment. Fr. Timothy Gallagher, in conversation with Kris McGregor, explains why this rule has the power to protect the spiritual life over an entire lifetime.
Rule Five is direct and uncompromising. In time of spiritual desolation, never make a change. The rule applies to any spiritual proposal that was in place before the desolation began. Prayer commitments. Retreat plans. Parish involvement. Spiritual direction. Even major vocational decisions. When desolation is present, change must wait.
Fr. Gallagher explains why Ignatius insists on this rule without exception. In spiritual consolation, the good spirit guides and counsels. In spiritual desolation, it is the enemy who guides and counsels. The thoughts that arise during desolation may feel convincing. They may sound reasonable. Yet they do not lead to clarity or peace. They lead away from it.
Through concrete examples, Fr. Gallagher shows how Rule Five works in daily life. A person feels heaviness in prayer and considers canceling a meeting with a pastor. Another feels discouraged and wants to abandon a retreat planned months earlier. In each case, the questions are the same. Am I in a time of spiritual desolation? Am I considering changing something that was decided before the desolation began? When the answer to both is yes, the response is firm. Do not change.
The episode carefully distinguishes spiritual desolation from non-spiritual desolation. Physical exhaustion, anxiety, or emotional strain may require practical changes, such as rest or balance. Yet even here, Ignatius’s wisdom often applies. Many discouraging thoughts still arise from desolation and must be resisted, not obeyed.
Fr. Gallagher explains that Rule Five does not mean changes are never made. Changes may be considered in times of peace, tranquility, or spiritual consolation. They must be made prayerfully and wisely. What Ignatius forbids is change during desolation, when judgment is clouded and discouragement distorts reality.
To illuminate the rule, Fr. Gallagher draws on an image from J. R. R. Tolkien. He recalls the scene in which Frodo receives a small light with the words, “This will be a light when all other lights go out.” Rule Five serves the same purpose. When darkness presses in and everything urges change, this rule becomes a steady light that preserves freedom.
Fr. Gallagher concludes by returning to Ignatius himself. Even at the height of his sanctity, Ignatius experienced profound spiritual desolation. Thoughts arose urging him to abandon plans already discerned. Because he recognized desolation and remained firm, clarity returned. The discernment was completed. Peace followed.
Episode Seven presents Rule Five as a lifelong companion. It is a rule that saves the heart from confusion. It protects decisions made in grace. It becomes a steady guide when all other lights seem to fail.
DOS7-REV
Discerning Hearts Questions for Reflection and Study
Personal Reflection
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Can you recall moments when discouragement urged you to abandon a spiritual commitment?
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How do you recognize heaviness of heart in your own experience of prayer?
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What spiritual proposals were in place in your life before recent struggles began?
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How does knowing Rule Five change the way you interpret discouraging thoughts?
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Where might firmness and fidelity bring freedom rather than rigidity?
Group Reflection or Study
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Why does Ignatius insist that Rule Five admits no exceptions?
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How do the examples in this episode help clarify the danger of change in desolation?
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Why do discouraging thoughts often feel convincing during desolation?
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How does the Tolkien image help illuminate the purpose of Rule Five?
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How might this rule protect parish communities and leaders from burnout or retreat?

The 14 Rules for Discerning Spirits –
“The Different Movements Which Are Caused In The Soul” as outlined by St. Ignatius of Loyola click here
For the other episodes in this series visit Fr. Timothy Gallagher’s “Discerning Hearts”click here
Father Timothy M. Gallagher, O.M.V., was ordained in 1979 as a member of the Oblates of the Virgin Mary, a religious community dedicated to retreats and spiritual formation according to the Spiritual Exercises of St. Ignatius. Fr. Gallagher is featured on the EWTN series “Living the Discerning Life: The Spiritual Teachings of St. Ignatius of Loyola”
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