Reframing through documentation

In this episode, Jack Cochran and Matthew James are joined by Hannah Bloking, and Allison Macalik, co-founders of 4Under3. They discuss the universal challenge of imposter syndrome in the pre-sales profession, exploring how it manifests, why it affects nearly everyone, and practical strategies to address it. Hannah and Allison share insights from their workshops, including powerful techniques like the "lighthouse speaker" mindset and the importance of naming your imposter to take control of those negative thoughts.

Thank you to Storylane for sponsoring this episode.

Follow the Hosts and Guests

• Connect with Jack Cochran: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jackcochran/

• Connect with Matthew James: https://www.linkedin.com/in/matthewyoungjames/

• Connect with Hannah Bloking: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hannahcfrisch/

• Connect with Allison Macalik: https://www.linkedin.com/in/allisonmacalik/

Links and Resources Mentioned

• Storylane: https://storylane.io

• Join Presales Collective: https://www.presalescollective.com/community-overview

• 4Under3: https://4under3.io/

• Email: info@4under3.io

• Follow 4Under3 on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/4under3/

Timestamps

00:00 Opening

03:36 Why Focus on Impostor Syndrome

11:57 The Definition of Impostor Syndrome

14:45 Redefinining as a Phenomenon

20:15 Soft Skills is Important

24:50 The Lighthouse Speaker Mindset

27:15 Zip it, Todd!

Key Topics Covered

1. Understanding Imposter Syndrome

   • The textbook definition: "The persistent inability to believe that one's success is deserved or has been legitimately achieved as a result of one's own efforts or skills"

   • Why it's being reframed as "imposter phenomenon" rather than syndrome

   • How it manifests differently for everyone

   • The discovery that it affects people of all genders, levels, and backgrounds

2. The Presales Connection

   • Why imposter syndrome is particularly prevalent in pre-sales roles

   • The challenge of being asked to be an expert when you're still learning

   • Why internal demos to your own team are the hardest presentations to give

   • The adrenaline rush of presenting and how it relates to imposter feelings

3. Breaking the Silence

   • Why people suffer in silence with imposter syndrome

   • The power of creating space for vulnerability before major initiatives

   • How company culture needs to embrace these conversations

   • The importance of repeat workshops and ongoing dialogue

4. Practical Techniques

   • The Lighthouse Speaker vs. Spotlight Speaker: Thinking of yourself as lighting the way for others rather than being under scrutiny

   • Naming Your Imposter: Giving your negative self-talk a name (like "Todd") to externalize and control it

   • Reframing: Documenting what happens to realize most failures aren't actually about you

   • Finding Your Person: Identifying someone who can hold you accountable when your imposter is talking

5. The Workshop Impact

   • Why companies become repeat customers

   • How addressing imposter syndrome improves productivity and retention

   • The connection between soft skills training and embracing new frameworks

   • Creating internal communities (like AWS's "The Nest") for ongoing support

6. Looking Forward

   • The personal nature of addressing imposter syndrome

   • The importance of daily practice and repetition

   • How workshops facilitate conversations but individuals must do the work

   • The evolving nature of imposter syndrome as AI and change management accelerate