How to Build a Community for Overtired

Overtired 268

[00:00:00] Brett: Hey listeners. It’s Brett here. I haven’t slept since the last time we recorded, which was a couple of days ago. I am, I am in shit shape, but fortunately I have help. I’m here with Christina Warren, you know, my long-time co-host and returning guest, Bryan Guffey. How are you guys?

[00:00:24] Christina: Good, good. I’m I’m pretty good. I have slept. Um, I’m on, I’m on vacation mode. I am flying out. Um, to Atlanta early tomorrow morning, so I’ve got to do laundry and stuff. And, um, uh, but yeah, I just ordered my dad’s Christmas gift, um, which I realized was very last minute, but I thought that I’d done it earlier and I didn’t, but they did have a Sonos from, um, at a local best buy in Atlanta.

[00:00:52] Well, it’ll be available for pickup on the 23rd, but I wasn’t able to get, I had to wait for father’s day, like months for his, [00:01:00] for his Sonos. Like I had to order it in may to get it like sometime at the end of June. So I was happy that this time I didn’t have to wait as long for another

[00:01:10] Bryan: Sonos.

[00:01:11] Brett: You spent a lot of time on a consumerism. This isn’t an insult. That sounds mean, but like, So many topics, our Christina’s like waiting to get a brand new laptop or Christina’s like hunting down a PS4. Like you spend a lot of time on like, not just shopping, but like difficult shopping.

[00:01:33] Christina: No, you’re not wrong. And, and, and, and it’s, it’s a fair criticism. I think about that a lot,

[00:01:37] actually. I’m Like yeah, I know. I know. But no, I mean, it’s, it’s, uh, it’s sort of this, well, we’ll talk about our mental health, but it’s sort of how I deal with things to be completely honest. And it’s not the most healthy way, but it is what it is.

[00:01:49] in this case, I just literally finished doing that, before we started the pot.

[00:01:53] Brett: I just like, I don’t have the energy for that kind of stuff. If it takes, it takes too long or [00:02:00] it’s too hard to track down. I just, I, I, I don’t, that’s why I don’t have that much stuff.

[00:02:06] Christina: Well, in this case, I didn’t have to track it down in that difficult late,

[00:02:10] like for, for this particular thing.

[00:02:11] Brett: you had to, you had to put an order in and wait for it and.

[00:02:15] Christina: Oh, I mean that, I mean in months to go, yeah, for, for this particular one, though, It actually works out because I will be getting into Atlanta and then we will pick it up on the 23rd. So it’s actually easier, but

[00:02:26] Bryan: sure.

[00:02:26] Brett: Fair enough, Brian, how are you?

[00:02:30] Bryan: Um, you know, it’s, it’s Saturday and I have three days left to work for the rest of the year. So that’s like, yeah. And then though, and we’ll get into the thumb, but I am looking forward to not working so that I can work. If you all know what

[00:02:46] Christina: that’s like.

[00:02:46] Brett: Totally. My vacation started today. I’ve been working all day.

[00:02:52] Bryan: Yeah. I was going to

[00:02:52] Christina: say, I was like, my vacation technically started, um, Wednesday, although I was, uh, doing, um, [00:03:00] uh, I went into the office on Thursday. Last time we recorded. And, um, I I’m also in this place where I’m like, yes, I’m actually looking forward to being able to get some actual work done because I don’t go back until third or the fourth or whatever day

[00:03:14] Bryan: that is.

[00:03:16] Yeah, same. I’m just looking forward to actually doing some training, having time to do training and learn some stuff. So excited, just got work to pay for like $1,200 worth of it, lasting and training. So I’m thrilled.

[00:03:28] Brett: Wait, can’t you do that during work though?

[00:03:30] Bryan: Well, we’re going to get into that. I would like to, that would be awesome.

[00:03:36] Christina: That would be awesome.

[00:03:37] Wouldn’t it? I was going to say, wouldn’t it be great? Like we have, sometimes we have these like days of learning thing, which is ends up just being like, oh, you’re not supposed to have meetings these days and you can focus on your own things. And then inevitably other people will like not respect the day of learning and be like, oh no, we have to have this meeting at this time.

[00:03:55] I’m like, well,

[00:03:57] Bryan: well thanks.

[00:03:58] Brett: I just like, I, [00:04:00] I myself those days, they don’t offer them, but I’m like, Hey, I need today. I’m going to be heads down. And then I, I go heads down. I like clothes, slack. I just ignore work for a day.

[00:04:13] Bryan: Nice.

[00:04:14] Brett: It takes some effort.

[00:04:15] Christina: Okay, so, so, okay. So we should just go right into Brett’s mental health corner, AKA mental health corner, because you haven’t slept.

[00:04:24] Brett: Yeah. I am like low key manic, which sounds like a contradiction in terms, but I’m like super calm. I went to breakfast with my parents this morning and I let them know, like I hadn’t been sleeping and that I was having a bit of a manic episode. And my mom’s like, you seem totally level, like, I I’m, I’m not coming across as crazy, but I’m not sleeping.

[00:04:52] That’s like the only symptom of this is I’m not sleeping and therefore I’m tired. Um, but like I have [00:05:00] that coding obsession, like I put way too much effort into bunch or not bunch, uh, doing yesterday because I can’t stop. But this morning, like, It turned out that code samples on my blog, when a code sample was inside of a list, it was being rendered with a space at the beginning of every line.

[00:05:21] So if you copied code out and pasted it into a script, it wouldn’t work because the hash bang at the beginning of the script would have a space before it. And this is, this is annoying. I mean, sure. People could fix it on their end, but, um, I write a lot of code on my blog. I can’t have this. So I spent three hours tracking down.

[00:05:45] I have so many plugins running and it turned out, I didn’t even know how my code blocks were being syntax, highlighted, like everything. I was working wasn’t and something completely unexplainable [00:06:00] was creating my code blocks. ultimately after three hours, I ended up writing a Jekyll hook does a brute force, red jacks, uh, D uh, like out, out debting of all rendered code blocks before they go to the blog.

[00:06:18] Uh, it’s it’s ugly. It works. I love Jekyll’s hooks. can, you can do so much with hooks, but also it’s fucking annoying. I am mad at Jekyll and I love Jekyll at the same.

[00:06:35] Christina: Yeah. I noticed that that was in a, in, in the show notes. What, we’ll come to that. Um, uh, Brian, how’s your mental health?

[00:06:42] Bryan: Oh man. Well, you know, let’s see, uh, fine ish. Like I’m talking about, I’m excited about we’re going to have this break. Things are going to be nice. I’m going to be too bored and we’re going to find things to do, but at the moment, you know, everything that’s going [00:07:00] on in the world with, um, Omnicon variant.

[00:07:05] It’s stressing me the heck out. And you know, mostly just worried about my friends. Like, I’m good doing what I do. I stay at home all the time. I don’t go anywhere, but like, that’s stressful. And then this stuff going on with this discord community that I created with friends a while ago, it was just kind of like a messy and it makes me wonder, like, will you ever have like decent community on the internet or is it always going to like devolve into terrible stuff?

[00:07:30] So like, we’re deciding about, are we going to shut it down or what are we going to do? You know? And so like, that’s been, that’s been kind of a sad conversation that’s been going on. I’m like, yeah, I’m like a six out of 10.

[00:07:44] Brett: I would point out that like our, our discord for over-tired is not super active compared to some of the discourse I’m on, but we have great people there that are always friendly and I’ve yet to have like any [00:08:00] meltdowns in that community.

[00:08:03] Bryan: Yeah. And I think that’s part of, uh, that’s one of the things that I think I’ve learned this community like blew up because like, it was launched on Tik TOK and it was one of those things that went viral. So we’ve got like 8,000 people in a day. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. And, um, we learned a lot through this process, but what we learned is that I think you have to build, like, we spend a lot of time being intentional about the community, but like the people who came in and weren’t intentional.

[00:08:34] Christina: Right, right. That’s actually a really good point because you can be intentional about how you’re creating it. But if the people who you’re bringing in don’t have those same, don’t have that same understanding, then it can, it can be a different place.

[00:08:49] Bryan: Yeah. I’ve been thinking a lot about the number of people over the past couple of years, and we launched it in the pandemic.

[00:08:54] Right. That’s the other part, a lot of people over the past couple of years, we’ve only sort of gotten to be adults [00:09:00] on the internet because they’re like, you know, they’re like college students and like their whole lives have been on the internet as adults. And what that means and how you think about things and how like you engage with people.

[00:09:13] And also they grew up in a world where Donald Trump was always like somebody who was maybe running for president and what that’s done to us.

[00:09:21] Christina: Right. And, and is also, I mean, I think even like taking some of like the, the world thinks about it, like they’re college students. So, you know, when you’re that age, you’re self absorbed and you have your own kind of shit and you have your own way of doing things and you’re not completely developed.

[00:09:34] And you know, like it’s, it’s different. Um, like I, I can look back at my own life, you know, which was on the internet, um, as, as were both of you, you know, then, and I’m like, yeah, shit. I. Uh, the difference then I think slightly cause I did have Facebook, but it was like, there was some sense of, um, anonymity and other stuff.

[00:09:57] So you could at least like your mistakes were hidden, [00:10:00] but you know, it’s, it’s different now. Like it’s just it, but not even now, I guess it’s just like, it’s that age, you know, where, where people have different ways of interacting. Like you grow out of stuff, you know what I mean? Not everyone does, but a lot of people do.

[00:10:13] Bryan: Oh yeah, absolutely. And we had like real friends in real space that we could go hang out with and we weren’t on the internet all of the time I was too, but like I was on, but like we also were on the internet, but also in person with people like that whole part of it is gone now, especially for the past two years, like just

[00:10:32] Christina: gone.

[00:10:33] Yeah. Yeah. No, I, I, I think about that a lot. I think about like, uh, especially, not even so much a college, I mean that, that has to suck, but especially like kids in high school, because that’s an even more like. Fucked up age. And so I think about kids like middle school, high school, I’m like, shit, you know, if all you have is the drama that happens online and you don’t even have the opportunity to deal with any of the in-person drama, [00:11:00] you know, which is different, but also sometimes better.

[00:11:03] Like you can at least get it out in the open. Um, whereas online everybody’s just catty fucking bitches. Um, like it’s, uh, God, I don’t even want to think about like what the social dynamics would be like if you’d spent the last two years, you know, at, especially if you kind of like, you’ve been like on, off, you know what I mean?

[00:11:23] It’s like, okay, we were all at home and then we were kind of in person and now we’re kind of at home again. And then there are some people like there’s this interesting New York times article, um, uh, about how generation Z. Over the pandemic and I don’t blame them. Like, I, I don’t blame a number of people who are like, yeah, I am not giving up the rest of my life anymore.

[00:11:48] I’m I’m just going to be, um, you know, um, I’m just going to try to go bond in, in, um, thank you, grant. Uh, my husband just brought me up food, [00:12:00] but like, I’m just going to try to go on and live more normally. And there’s a certain selfishness to that. Right. But I also, I feel like if I were 18 years old, there would be a big part of me who would be like, yeah, fuck it.

[00:12:11] I’m going to be vaccinated and be trying to be safe around other people, but I’m not going to not go to parties. You know what I mean? Like

[00:12:19] Bryan: my parents are like on the other side, like near 70 or like, and I’m like, stay home, stay home. And my dad is like, I am only going to live so much longer. So I’m going to do the best that I can learn.

[00:12:31] Like take precautions. But like, I’m going to go on the trips that I have planned and I’m like, I don’t love that, but also, you know, you have to, I can’t make you do things that you don’t want to do. And again, it really shouldn’t be, it shouldn’t be everybody’s responsibility to do this. No.

[00:12:50] Christina: Right. Well, that’s the thing.

[00:12:52] If there was a better way and other countries did do it better and, and, and, and it’s, and I also like the, you talk about the Alma con stuff, like [00:13:00] it’s stressful, or for me, like for mental health, like, because I’m, you know, I’m flying home, um, to my parents’ house tomorrow. Um, you know, they’re in their seventies.

[00:13:11] Um, they’ve been triple back. Um, they’ve been taking all the precautions. A very good friend of theirs has been in the hospital since before Thanksgiving with a COVID pneumonia. She’s probably not going to make it. And which is devastating. And, um, you know, and, and she, I don’t know if she had the booster or not, but she definitely had, you know, uh, think she did actually, know, but they’ve lost friends and so they’re concerned.

[00:13:37] Um, but then I’m concerned about my own thing. I’m like, okay, I am obviously going to be, and I I’m triple backs and, and I’ll be wearing my mask on the plane and everything, but I don’t know about everybody else. And with how contagious step is like, I do have like this peer I’m like, I don’t want to infect anyone, but at the same time, like this weird thing is like, I, [00:14:00] after didn’t see them for, you know, 18 months that was devastating too.

[00:14:08] you know, you have like this weird, like, kind of like trade-off thing is like, what do you do? You know, like, It it’s stressful because you don’t want to put people in harm’s way, but at the same time, kind of like your parents wanting to go on their trips me at a certain point, I’m like, all right, I can take all the precautions I can, I can know that I’m feeling well.

[00:14:25] And I don’t want to obviously get anyone sick, but is, is the better off is the better option to not see people because that feels worse in

[00:14:35] Bryan: some ways. Yup, absolutely.

[00:14:42] Brett: Hey. Yeah. Um, I, I I’m glad you had a good conversation. I don’t know what it was about. I got

[00:14:51] Bryan: Completely fine.

[00:14:52] Brett: I was reading. So I had read about log for Java or log for shell.

[00:14:56] Bryan: Uh huh.

[00:14:59] Brett: I [00:15:00] had, I understood like in general what the vulnerabilities were, but, uh, Brian posted a link that actually goes into a lot more detail about

[00:15:10] Bryan: Um,

[00:15:10] Brett: what, like, this is

[00:15:12] Bryan: It’s real fucking bad.

[00:15:13] Brett: fascinating that this hasn’t been a problem until like that.

[00:15:19] No one noticed this before. This is some, this is some just blatantly bad programming.

[00:15:25] Christina: It is. And, and I want to be, so we’re going to talk about this. Um, do we need to do a sponsor break first?

[00:15:31] Brett: Yeah. Hey, I wrote, I wrote up the, uh, the first sponsor reads so that it didn’t have any of my personal stuff in it. And if you want to take it, I would be much obliged.

[00:15:42] Bryan: All right.

[00:15:43] Sponsor: Bespoke Post

[00:15:43] Christina: So this episode is brought to you by bespoke post a, this winner upgrade your daily routine with bespoke posts and their new seasonal lineup of a Mustang. Box of awesome collections. I love the name box of awesome post, uh, partners, small businesses [00:16:00] and emerging brands to bring you the most unique goods every month.

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[00:17:06] Bryan: first box.

[00:17:07] Brett: They have, uh, they have new boxes, like, uh, uh, music and kitchen

[00:17:14] Bryan: No.

[00:17:14] Brett: and like some of their stuff, like they have boxes for people who drink and smoke and, and I don’t do either of those things anymore. Uh, but, um, I’m super curious to try the music boxes. I love music stuff, even if I’m not listening to music anymore.

[00:17:33] I still like the gear.

[00:17:36] Anal sex, somehow

[00:17:36] Bryan: I run into that too. I’m not listening to music hardly at all anymore, and it’s a thing I’m trying to figure out a balance for, because I listened to so many podcasts

[00:17:45] Christina: all the time, right? Yeah. No, that is a weird thing where like, and I don’t know. Have you noticed this Brian, like, um, you, you used to commute and for your, you still working.

[00:17:55] Bryan: Yeah. I’m I’m still working from home and I’ve been like working from home permanently, but [00:18:00] I used to drive a lot

[00:18:01] Christina: for work. Right, right. And I don’t know about you, but like, for me, when I had that like commute time, that was my podcast or audio book time. And so the rest of my listening was like music.

[00:18:13] And now, because I don’t have like that, you know, like, you know, hour and a half a day or whatever, like my music time, it becomes more difficult, I guess, because I probably do listen to more podcasts and other stuff.

[00:18:27] Bryan: Absolutely. I agree. A hundred, 110%, which I’ve learned is one of my catchphrases 110%. I say that all the time.

[00:18:35] But yeah, I don’t, I don’t know when to figure out to listen to music because like I get caught in this, like, we’ll have some Institute in the right mode. I can’t just be doing other things at the same time and yeah.

[00:18:47] Brett: have two things to tell you, and I’ll try not to be long-winded first, uh, audio books. I, I, I just finished my second time through a fall or Dodge in [00:19:00] hell. Uh, the main character gets his brain like scanned after he dies and gets put into like a digital world. And he’s the first one there and he becomes God, but then another person comes in, kicks him out and he becomes the fallen angel, like the devil.

[00:19:14] And it’s this whole world that it’s, it’s bizarre. And then I went backwards and th that was by Neil Stevenson. So I, I picked up an older book of his called ream D, which is read me misspelled. Um,

[00:19:31] Bryan: Hmm.

[00:19:32] Brett: and I didn’t realize it, but I’m getting started and it’s the same characters, but before they were dead and it’s a real trip, um,

[00:19:41] it’s weird to read it in reverse.

[00:19:44] Christina: that, that that’s them. Okay. So where you supposed to read it? And the opposite.

[00:19:48] Brett: They were published in the opposite order. So ideally, yes. I just it’s like one’s in the real world and one isn’t, so it’s almost incomparable, but [00:20:00] it’s like getting the origin story for a hero.

[00:20:05] Christina: no, I was going to say, I love that. I remember a completely genre, but I remember one of the first Freddie Pinellas books I read was, was not his first book, less than zero. And I think it was rules of attraction was the first one I read. But there was a reference to some of the less than zero characters.

[00:20:22] I remember when I read less than zero being like, oh yeah. Okay. That’s where that person comes from. has other books, like a character show up in glamour, Rama, and I’m an American psycho and stuff like that. But, uh, that’s always fun. I think when you do the inverse of what you’re supposed to do where you’re like, oh, okay, this is the origin story of this that I experienced in this other way.

[00:20:44] Brett: Story of my life.

[00:20:46] Christina: Yeah, which also funnily enough character from story of my life in glamour Roma, but that’s even different authors.

[00:20:53] Brett: Like, I feel like you shouldn’t have anal sex until you’ve had vaginal sex, unless you’re gay. And that’s like, and [00:21:00] that’s your, your option,

[00:21:02] Bryan: I was totally above.

[00:21:04] Brett: 4, 4, 4, 4, a straight man. Like, I, I feel like anal. Isn’t interesting until you’ve had vaginal personal opinion, don’t at

[00:21:17] Bryan: Okay. Okay.

[00:21:18] Brett: cause I

[00:21:19] Bryan: Okay.

[00:21:20] Brett: and, and

[00:21:22] Bryan: oh, interesting.

[00:21:23] Brett: yeah, it, it, I feel like it might, my experience would have been different if I had more background that said the other thing I was going to tell you was, not about anal sex.

[00:21:36] It was.

[00:21:38] Bryan: I was going to

[00:21:38] Christina: say, I cannot believe I’m learning so much. This is really interesting.

[00:21:42] Brett: It was last night. My girlfriend says to me, my girlfriend says, she says, think I would like Adele, at which point I realized she hadn’t heard a Dell.

[00:21:53] Bryan: Oh,

[00:21:54] Brett: and I’m not like a die hard fan, but I, I, love and respect a [00:22:00] Dell.

[00:22:00] Bryan: yeah.

[00:22:01] Brett: so I, I, we started with a rolling in the deep, just,

[00:22:06] Christina: Yes. You got to go with the greatest. Yeah.

[00:22:08] Brett: the greatest hits.

[00:22:09] And she was like, oh yeah, I have heard this, but we gave it a good listen. then we moved on, uh, through 21 and into whatever that 30 is that the new one. Um, and got just a, kind of a broad range of Adele. And I realized in the process. Her voice is better than I ever realized.

[00:22:31] Bryan: Yes.

[00:22:32] Brett: it is phenomenal.

[00:22:35] Like it’s, it’s, it’s chilling to listen to. so I have a new found respect for Adele and it is the first time I’ve actually sat and intentionally listen to music in a long time. It was kind of.

[00:22:50] Christina: I would love to hear Brian’s take on this because you are actually the vocal, like master of the three of us.

[00:22:56] Bryan: Um, yeah, I love, I love [00:23:00] a bell. I, I, let me say this. I love a girl’s voice. I think one of the things that is really amazing is with Adele. She’s an incredible example of how a voice matures as you get older and that there, that you can discover like depths and colors and tones that you didn’t have access to before.

[00:23:22] And I think that’s what we’re hearing and 30, which is a really special opportunity, uh, to do with somebody like Adele, because it’s so rare that you have artists. Like Adele, another great example of this, this Taylor swift, who has continued to mature, but like we don’t see so many artists anymore that we get to sort of really chart them over their entire time.

[00:23:51] Um, they’ve I mean, Adele’s been doing this for us for like over

[00:23:55] Christina: 10 years. Yeah. Yeah. I mean the first time most of us heard her, I certainly first time I ever [00:24:00] heard her was she was on Saturday night, live in 2008, the episode that Sarah Palin, um, uh, hosted, which was one of the most viewed episodes ever, because, you know, that was the same season that Tina Fey was doing her impression.

[00:24:16] And, um, uh, and that, and that was the episode where Amy Poehler famously had the wrap and the weekend update, which was just like, she was so pregnant. She was just like going at it. Um, but, um, you know, she was the musical guest for that episode, which. Talk about pressure. I mean, I can’t even imagine, you know, you have, like, I think it was one of the highest rated episodes of the show it had in years and years.

[00:24:40] And, uh, she nailed it. And I remember watching it with grant and being like, holy shit, who is this? You know, and just being like, okay, well I’m a fan now. And you’re right. You know, we’ve been watching her for, you know, four albums and it’s like, her voice has matured and [00:25:00] gotten better. And I, uh, I was making a comparison to my mom, um, uh, to Barbara Streisand.

[00:25:07] And my mom was kind of disagreeing a little bit, but I was able to, I think maybe pull her in to me. Like she does remind me of Barbara in the sense that like, both of them at very young ages had very mature voices, but their voices did improve. Like you said, and kind of grow over time. The difference being it’d be like what in Barbara Streisand was huge obviously in, in, in the seventies and stuff.

[00:25:29] But like, imagine if Barbara Streisand was like the biggest star in the world, Which I think is interesting about her because she’s got this amazing talent and this like truly amazing gift and the type of music that she sings and the stuff that she does, like is not even the typical, like diva, like Whitney Houston, Christina Aguilera, like Brian Carey, like those type of vocal goddesses thing.

[00:25:52] Like it’s a different type of voice. And you know what I mean? Like, like it is this kind of older throwback voice that we haven’t had in [00:26:00] our generation. Like, I can’t think of anybody

[00:26:03] that we’ve had. Who’s

[00:26:04] Brett: Chad Kruger.

[00:26:06] Christina: okay. I mean, look at this photograph. Of course I am forgetting about a

[00:26:11] Nickelback. Thank you.

[00:26:12] Brett: think you would know who that was. And I was going to

[00:26:14] Christina: Oh,

[00:26:14] Brett: of explaining nickel back to you, but

[00:26:17] Christina: oh no.

[00:26:17] I, I,

[00:26:18] I,

[00:26:18] Brett: for me.

[00:26:19] Christina: I, I unfortunately know nickel back. Uh, this is how you remind me bitch. Um,

[00:26:25] Brett: that up on Wikipedia.

[00:26:27] Bryan: C, C.

[00:26:28] Brett: it feels like we need a Nickelback joke at this point. So I, I went to Wikipedia, did the homework and turns out

[00:26:34] Christina: You did the homework well for, for the audience, don’t, don’t listen to Nickelback, but, um,

[00:26:41] Bryan: you know, I told you all about the time, just as a side note bill for like, really you do not need to listen to, um, we’re going to add a creed into

[00:26:49] Christina: that group. My fucking God. Yes.

[00:26:52] Bryan: However,

[00:26:53] Brett: new girl last night and

[00:26:55] Bryan: I have created stories.

[00:26:56] Brett: been to like 48 creed shows. And to me, that’s a red [00:27:00] flag.

[00:27:01] Bryan: I, in 2009, uh, so this would have been the 2009, no, 2003. So let’s go much further back in college with two, I think maybe my first pride ever in Cleveland and they were having a talent show called like, um, Cleveland pride, pride, rainbow idle, and I won Cleveland pride, rainbow idle singing creeds, arms wide open.

[00:27:28] Christina: That’s amazing. That is amazing.

[00:27:30] Bryan: Especially because I had no idea that they were a Christian band at the time. Oh

[00:27:33] Christina: yeah, well, yeah. W with their Christian S uh, was, was the whole thing. Um, so I knew people who like a guy that I used to work with this was way back in the day, like used to, like his cousin was in creed at one point and whatnot.

[00:27:48] And I used to hear stories about what a Dick, uh, what was his name? Scott staff was. But my favorite story ever was when the people on speaking of like asshole Lish, like trolls, like when [00:28:00] you’re in college, I’ll never forget this. I remember this happened in life journal. It was like peak live journal was this girl, met him at a bar at an airport and gave him her friend’s number.

[00:28:12] And the friend started texting with him and got him to have his sister drive him to a Denny’s in some like part of Florida, like an hour and a half away from where he was like hookup for a booty call. And all of these college kids showed up at the Denny’s and like took photographic evidence. It like picking up like this, you know, kind of like, you know, like coked out, like drunk Scott staff, like looking for some girl to hook up with.

[00:28:41] And then I think some other girl wound up taking him home. Didn’t do anything with him. And, but he was just like scrounging for like wanting drugs and stuff. And she just like, let him sleep it off, like at our apartment or whatever. And then like he went back the next day. I don’t remember all the details of this story, except that it was like peak live [00:29:00] journal in college.

[00:29:00] That was like one of the most amazing things I ever remember about creating.

[00:29:03] Bryan: That was amazing. That was so basic. Oh my gosh. Speaking of live journal, literally still have a friend today that I made on live journal that I’ve never met in person, but now. We now live just like a couple hours away. Cause they live well, not a couple, but they live in San Francisco.

[00:29:22] Um, but when we became friends on live journal, they were living in like Sweden. That’s

[00:29:28] Christina: so cool. I live journal is like my, why my first true, like social media, like loves

[00:29:35] it. And it was one of the only ones that had like, it had shit, right? Like you, the way that the friends list works and the way that you could make things that were only viewable to some people and the way that, you know, like the, the way the feed works, like it was, it was really ahead of it.

[00:29:49] Brett: I never use live journal. I thought it was like blogger. Is it a whole social network?

[00:29:55] Christina: Kind of kind of, so you could use it like a blogger, but the way that it [00:30:00] started was, uh, was, was Brad, um, uh, Fitzpatrick who, um, I’ve because of a journal I’ve known for 20 years now. Um, he created it to keep up with his college friends for people to kind of check in with one another. And so the idea would be like you had a blog, but you could also be friends with people and you would see on your friends list their posts.

[00:30:18] So it’s kind of like a tumbler dashboard. Um,

[00:30:21] Brett: like tumbling.

[00:30:22] Christina: tumbler ripped off a lot of stuff with it, but one of the differentiating things was, is you could also choose whether you want it to make a post private friends only, or if you only wanted to show it to a select group of friends. And that was really unique.

[00:30:37] They also had communities, uh, pretty early on so that you could also be part of community. So it was sort of a hybrid. Kind of like, almost like, like Facebook groups, um, uh, you know, but, but earlier where people could, could post, you know, messages and posts that would appear to community members in your feed, it was, um, like tumbler really.

[00:30:57] What’s kind of like a different [00:31:00] kind of, I guess, take on it, but then it did have, you know, if you just wanted to use it as a blog, it was a Pearl based blogging system. So, um, it was a bit, but I think it, it, I think it predated blogger and if it didn’t predate blogger, like they were literally at the same time, but they were, they were slightly different because blogger never had that network effect.

[00:31:21] So like, oftentimes you would meet people, at least how I met people is that you would have people on your friends list and then you would see them comment on stuff, or maybe they would, you know, to link to someone’s posts or you would go to their feed, like, and you could view like their, their feed, like at least the public stuff.

[00:31:36] And you’d be like, oh, this person looks interesting. I’m going to add them as a friend. And because. The internet was slightly different than, I mean, it was still terrible, but it was slightly different. It was smaller. Like you could, you know, meet people like, and find interesting people who live in places like Sweden, who might have similar interests as you.

[00:31:56] And like, I became friends with Brad who created it because I [00:32:00] followed his blog obviously. Cause he was, you know, that was another concept that you had people who you could be followed as you could usuals where you would both show up or you can just follow someone and see their posts. And, um, remember like, you know, we became friends in the comments of his blog and I, I wound up dating two of his college roommates, and uh, we’ve remained friends for 20 years and like, just, it’s just crazy to me.

[00:32:24] Like there are, there are other people in my life too that I’ve met through, through live journal, but it’s, it’s crazy to me like, like you Brian, like, like there are people that eat, there are people who I still never met in person, or I’ve met only once, but have remained like had online, you know, friendships.

[00:32:40] That I, that were reading my shit. When I was a high school student,

[00:32:45] Bryan: I found my life journal. Oh my God.

[00:32:49] Brett: Like just now, like you could put it in the show notes.

[00:32:52] Bryan: I could put it in the show notes. Wow. I may have to do that. This is, this is, this is wild. I have [00:33:00] to regroup. Yeah. I was going

[00:33:01] Christina: to, I was going to say, this was one of the other nice things about live journal by default. It was not indexed by Google and you would have to opt into it, which huge when your primary demographic is like teenagers or young adults.

[00:33:17] Because like, all of my electrical is just like high school, like senior high school through like college axed. So a lot of mine is just like drama sort of bullshit and stuff that I would not want. People too, you know what I mean? Like I, at this point enough time has passed. I don’t think I’d care, but it was my diary.

[00:33:36] You know what I mean? And so if it’s not the sort of thing, you’d want somebody to Google and find. Um, so did, but it didn’t have that feature. It was also, um, you familiar with memcache D Brett. Okay. So, so Brad creative and patchy, because he needed to find a way to scale live journal and keep it

[00:33:56] Brett: Oh,

[00:33:56] Christina: is even as, you know, a college kid who [00:34:00] created this thing, that then became this massive social network.

[00:34:04] and this was before you had people who would just give you tens of millions of dollars for that idea. So, um, for the first four or five years of his life, he was completely self-funded. They had, um, invites. That was how they at the scale at a certain way. So you had to get, you had to either pay for an invite code or someone had to invite you.

[00:34:22] You had to buy like a premium plan of like $15 a year or something. And that was how they paid for servers. But, uh, it was, uh, but then cashed you was, was created so that it would basically not like fall apart. And, uh, and that’s one of my favorite stories about it is that like this very important thing that is responsible for most of like the, the modern, like, like web 2.0 thing you know, something that, that Brad created out of necessity for live journal.

[00:34:52] Bryan: Oh yeah,

[00:34:53] Brett: quite the, little journey we just went on there.

[00:34:56] Bryan: we did. We

[00:34:57] Brett: We hit one of Christina’s magic [00:35:00] buttons. Um,

[00:35:02] Bryan: Um, yeah.

[00:35:03] Brett: our show notes did not include anal sex. Our

[00:35:07] Bryan: Nope,

[00:35:07] Brett: did not include creed or Nickelback. Our show notes did not include live journal. This has been, this show is it’s a beast of its own.

[00:35:16] Bryan: it is. It is.

[00:35:17] Christina: But, but we, we, we, we touched on this a little bit, but I want to talk more about this because I’m shocked that Brett didn’t know more about this. log for shell. Um, Brian, how, how shitty has your workweek been? Because of the,

[00:35:32] Bryan: honestly, I’m not too terrible. And I think that’s been, because we, again, don’t use too much Java, but also most of the Java we use is completely internal.

[00:35:46] And so we were really lucky in that case. Um, uh, basically, uh, Alaskans products don’t even use log for J 2.0, they’re still on like 1.7. So we were safe.

[00:35:59] Christina: You [00:36:00] were saying, yeah, there was, if you’ve had something enabled, there could be earlier versions of you did not have that enabled. Yeah. No, but you were talking, but like it’s just bad coding and you’re not wrong.

[00:36:11] I mean, like, I don’t want. Shit on the, the, you know, volunteers who’ve created and, and maintain this library. Cause that’s, I don’t want to like put it in the blame game, but I found in hacker news, like you could actually go back and you can find a feature request for the feature that enabled all of this terribleness and, and why they added it.

[00:36:32] And it is sort of a scary thing to look at and be like, wow, this was not a good idea. Like

[00:36:39] Bryan: at all,

[00:36:40] Brett: Yeah. Um, it’s just like, as far as I can tell everything could be by using the right function call for, for print statements. Uh, like it just seems, I don’t know why they made, made the decisions they did in the [00:37:00] original code. also doesn’t seem like it’s that hard to patch. I think the concern is mostly

[00:37:06] Bryan: no, it’s not

[00:37:07] Brett: getting the patch out there.

[00:37:09] Christina: right. And then the, and then the first patch.

[00:37:13] Brett: How so?

[00:37:14] Christina: Um, there, there, there was some other zero to a vulnerability that they found in the first pass at the first, first they put out a two.one, five oh, dot. Oh. Um, they immediately had to be like, no, no, no, no, no. Somebody found a zero day in that. And so

[00:37:29] you have to do something else.

[00:37:30] Bryan: Yeah,

[00:37:31] Brett: days where I’ve put out like four incremental releases within two hours, just because something’s just never get caught until you put them on see the light of day.

[00:37:40] Bryan: no,

[00:37:41] Christina: totally. But the scary thing is, is that when you’re talking about something that is used by like tens of millions of websites, you know what I mean? So, so you’ve got this

[00:37:49] weird thing where

[00:37:50] Brett: tens of millions of people don’t use my software?

[00:37:53] Christina: I am saying that, um, um, I, there, there you go. It’s tens of [00:38:00] billions. So we don’t even, it’s more people than exist on the planet

[00:38:02] are using.

[00:38:03] Brett: had 10 billion users, I wouldn’t be here talking to you about.

[00:38:08] Christina: Fucking fucking well said, but yeah, but the, um, it’s um, yeah, th this is just, uh, it’s real fucking bad.

[00:38:19] Bryan: Well, it’s really interesting because, uh, I was reading a lot of great stuff on Twitter about just how this talks about how open source is really kind of amazing and terrifying at the same time, because

[00:38:38] Christina: no, it’s

[00:38:39] Bryan: like, this is so big.

[00:38:44] Like people use this everywhere and it’s maintained by volunteers who oftentimes end up being the maintainers because they happen to be around when somebody asks, right. Someone’s like, I’m done, what will you do this? And they’re like, I guess, and [00:39:00] that, that works at all is really amazing. But like, it gives me better understanding for the value of companies sponsoring and hiring people specifically for the job of working on open-source projects and maintaining them.

[00:39:16] You know, the, the idea, like I was reading an article about somebody who works at Google, who now gets paid to like, all they do is work on open source and like maintain open source projects because it’s a value to Google who uses those open source projects to make sure that they’re well maintained.

[00:39:32] Christina: No.

[00:39:33] I mean, it’s okay. So what pisses me off about this? It’s not like that it happened and how poorly, you know, the code I haven’t written or whatnot, but the fact that like we had this instance with Heartbleed seven and a half years ago with the open, open SSH, um, uh, uh, uh, flaw, which was massive. And I will give the people behind Heartbleed so much kudos because having the name and the logo really, really fucking [00:40:00] helped, same thing with shell shock.

[00:40:01] Um, but, but, um, in this case, you know, we have like the fun kind of like, uh, made an Ms paint logo, but like, Brett, we’re going to talk about this in a second. The fact that you work at Oracle and you haven’t even heard that much about this to me is a problem this is way worse. Um, in terms of what you can do with it, then the open SSH book was, it’s not going to be as ubiquitous as, as, as a Heartbleed, but when a Heartbleed happened, like Mashable of all places now, granted, if it wasn’t SCO plate will not make any bones about that.

[00:40:32] But a lot of it was a, we genuinely wanted to help people update their passwords and make sure that sites they used were, updated Like I had tons and tons of people cause we maintain a huge database of, um, a list of sites that were vulnerable or warrant. And I had people reaching out to me who work at those sites and say, Hey, we patched now, can you, you know, update, you know, this, this list and whatnot.

[00:40:56] And, we, we led like a mainstream [00:41:00] site in 2014, like led coverage on that sort of thing. Whereas we haven’t seen, at least seen other than Twitter and in my own kind of, you know, like hacker news, like there hasn’t, it’s not, on to. A ton of times to talk about Heartbleed. I haven’t seen anybody talking about, you know, um, log for shell on, um, on cable news, which considering how bad it is is a problem.

[00:41:24] But to your point, like what me off is that when that happened, like the Linux foundation created this like, um, like core infrastructure projects. And I think it’s now called something else they were like, okay, for these really important core infrastructure tools on the web, we’re going to make sure that they have funding because what we discovered with heart lead with it open SSH, which is in it to be completely honest, like way more important of a library then than log for J, um, was, was being like, you know, uh, part-time maintainers and people who weren’t getting paid to do it.

[00:41:57] And, and that was when this [00:42:00] massive secure. Pending the web is a problem. And so we’ll explanation. Some other people were like, okay, we’re going to make sure that these projects are funded now lock for J just because of its ubiquity. Its LEMS like, I have the question. I’m like, okay, well there was a really good, a tweet thread from a security expert who was like, okay, why do we still not have a database somewhere?

[00:42:22] That’s just saying, okay, these are the most in use, like open-source projects and libraries. Not saying anything about even like, like how securely or whatnot, but like these are the things that are in used in those places. And maybe even like a, an analysis, like what’s the funding situation is this people who are able to work on it full-time is this, you know, like a volunteer thing, what’s the deal.

[00:42:43] So you could at least eyeball and say, cause we’re never gonna be able to catch all of the things that people use. It’s amazing that this shit doesn’t happen more often, but it’d be like useful to be like, okay, 15 million websites use this one. Maybe that’s a sign [00:43:00] that, that there should be, you know, like some sort of money set aside so that it can have a security audit every so often.

[00:43:07] Right? Like I just, it’s annoying to me that that happened when it feels like that would be than getting into the discussions of governance and this and that. And, and, you know, like whether or not open source is sustainable or this or that, like, which are all good things to happen, it feels like could get rid of some of the low hanging fruit, if you simply could eyeball, are the most used things.

[00:43:29] So this should be assigned for us to focus on like, are there security audits for these

[00:43:35] Bryan: projects?

[00:43:36] Brett: Um, so in defense of Oracle, I, I use AI to filter the emails I received from work. So I only see what’s important. Um, and I mute all, but like vital slack channels. And I basically like something like this can happen at Oracle and I, I [00:44:00] would not even realize it. In fact, Victor’s the one who pointed, pointed the whole thing out to me.

[00:44:05] Um, cause. But I just logged into slack and there, there are multiple channels dedicated to this on the Oracle slack. They are, and they have like five, five blog posts about it. Like they’re on it. it’s

[00:44:20] Bryan: Okay.

[00:44:21] Christina: Okay. That makes me feel so much better. Brian, does that make you feel better? The stewards of Java

[00:44:25] Bryan: are taking this seriously.

[00:44:30] Brett: They probably have a public slack about it too. They just started dipping their toes in a public slacks. having to use my authenticator app to load up Oracle security documents and see, let’s see affected products. Holy shit. Holy shit. I’m going to, I’m going to send you a screen cap.

[00:44:53] Christina: Yeah, I seriously, I can only imagine.

[00:44:55] Bryan: I mean,

[00:44:56] Brett: is I’m dropping it into Skype. [00:45:00] Uh, I can never remember how to get you if they move the chat button all the

[00:45:04] Bryan: I know.

[00:45:05] Brett: Okay, this is page one of five and then it breaks. It goes into Oracle products, not requiring patches. And that is a shorter list. Yeah, it’s nuts.

[00:45:23] Christina: Wow. No, I mean, so it’s funny because this, it was initially discovered in, in Minecraft servers. And so that was why, like, in one of our open source channels, it came up and we were like getting some of our Java people on it because we didn’t know how widespread it was. Cause at first. Oh, shit. Is this a Minecraft thing?

[00:45:41] And we were probably like internally, like another day and other Microsoft security fuck up, whatever. And then it was like, oh shit, no, this isn’t us at all. Like at all. Um, and, and, uh, you know, and everybody had to patch, like Baclays had like took themselves offline for like seven hours to [00:46:00] apply the patching.

[00:46:01] Um, like, fuck.

[00:46:05] Bryan: Yeah. Honestly, I it’s wild. Just absolutely wild and talking about patterning. Um, do we want to touch on, uh, how are

[00:46:19] Brett: Yeah, let’s talk about one.

[00:46:21] Christina: we, should we, should we do our next

[00:46:23] Bryan: one?

[00:46:23] Brett: Oh, yeah, I’ll do one. I’ll do one. I’ll take the, I’ll take the hit.

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[00:48:11] Bryan: Yes,

[00:48:12] M1 Woes

[00:48:12] Christina: Talk to you about your back was,

[00:48:14] Bryan: oh my gosh. So, um, I guess this may have started like a month or two ago and I don’t know what started it, but I would come in in the morning, um, and up my computer and it would have rebooted and I would log in and there was a car, there was a criminal panic that had happened.

[00:48:32] So your computer restarted because of a problem. And I didn’t think too much of it. A couple of times it was in the morning I came back in. I everything’s sort of started back up, so it wasn’t a problem. But then a couple of times that’d be sitting in front of my computer and the following thing would happen suddenly I was not connected to the internet anymore.

[00:48:52] Um, but it looked like I was connected to the internet, uh, things then the computer, the applications would [00:49:00] stop. Slowly. And it’d be like one application after another would start a beach ball and then sometimes it would go ahead and reboot itself and then it would come back up and there’d be Colonel panic.

[00:49:15] Again, I have tried to capture these laws and that’s the other thing that happens is when this starts to happen, if you try to open up activity monitor and like, look at the car or open up console, you can’t pull, like you can’t stream logs at the same time. Like it’s not capturing anything. Um, and then one thing I noticed this last time was that literally, like I went to the network connections and they had all disappeared and I’ve done safe mode.

[00:49:44] I’ve done everything and can’t figure out what’s going on. Literally re-installed dos without doing the wipe of the data, but you know, no clue what’s going on. And it seems like I’m not the only one that’s been having some worlds with them.

[00:49:56] Brett: Yeah, I, uh, a couple of weeks now I keep [00:50:00] getting force, quit dialogue comes up and says, I’ve run out of memory. But when you add up all of the, memory usage that it shows in the force, quit dialogue, it’s, I’m using like maybe four gigs of Ram total. And, but everything stops and. It everything locks up and I have to reboot the machine I don’t know why it happens.

[00:50:27] It always seems to happen when the computer isn’t being used. Like this always it’s always, when I come

[00:50:33] Bryan: Yeah.

[00:50:33] Brett: like hit my magic trackpad and it won’t click like the, the, uh, what’s it called tech tech, tactile, haptic, haptic, the haptic feedback. Won’t click. And that’s how I know that it’s starting.

[00:50:48] And then I’ll hit my keyboard and it’ll take like 30 seconds for the screen to come up and then I’ll have that force quit dialogue. And I just I’ve been forced to rebuilding it because it’s not worth waiting and trying to do a, [00:51:00] uh, proper shutdown. Um, but I haven’t seen kernel panics, but I’ve definitely, this is getting frustrating.

[00:51:07] And I’m on the verge of buying a Mac book pro because in my head that would solve it by another M one machine. It’ll be fine.

[00:51:19] Bryan: A newer processor at least, you know what I mean? But I did hear about that problem that people were having with the latest, uh, install of, uh, the upgrade of Monterey, the latest patch of Monterey, where people couldn’t install that.

[00:51:33] Brett: Yeah, Christina had a fun time.

[00:51:36] Christina: Yeah. I had a real fun time with that, actually. That was a real, that was a real fun time where, uh, um, tweets turned into a nine to five Mac article.

[00:51:42] Um, but that was just hilarious, but, um, uh, the, the good news about that was that there was actually a solution in the comments. Um, it was a, it was like, it was like the, the, um, like upgrade brain service or something like [00:52:00] that, that, that ended up needing to be quit. Like it was hanging for some reason. And so you’d like open system preferences to have the update that wouldn’t list.

[00:52:09] Then you had to shut down a certain force, but a certain process, then the update would show up. you’d start the update, but you’d have to like hit the stop button because it wouldn’t download and then you could restart it again and then it would finally work. yeah. Um, there’s, uh, the, the hardware is real fucking good.

[00:52:26] Um, the, the software there’ve been some, there’ve

[00:52:30] Bryan: been some bugs.

[00:52:31] Brett: Yeah.

[00:52:32] Bryan: Yeah.

[00:52:34] Brett: Are you going to get a new computer? Brian,

[00:52:37] Bryan: So Brett, I don’t know where I would fund that new computer from, uh, is the problem.

[00:52:43] Uh,

[00:52:43] Brett: of.

[00:52:46] Bryan: I mean, again, my upstart is my boyfriend and he would be like, listen, why do you need a new computer? I’m like, well, here’s the problem. And he’d be like, well, can’t, you literally send it back and probably get it replaced.

[00:52:58] And I’m like, yes, but I [00:53:00] don’t want to go back to my work. I use my, like this, I use this for everything. Um, and I don’t want to use my work like Intel backward pro though. I could really got the

[00:53:10] Christina: replacement. I mean, you do have two weeks off.

[00:53:14] Bryan: That’s true. I could do that. And I mean, luckily as you thought, you thank you so much for your help, but like several people have been like, if it happens again, I’m glad to help you know, and see what’s going on.

[00:53:25] And I have a friend who’s a genius. Who’s like, here’s how you get somebody to like, literally get you a new computer. If you need

[00:53:31] Brett: Like an apple genius or literal genius,

[00:53:34] Bryan: Like you’re an apple genius actually

[00:53:38] Brett: genius.

[00:53:39] Bryan: literal genius,

[00:53:40] Brett: That’s the title of this episode is just literal genius. Or a beginner’s guide to anal sex. I can’t decide

[00:53:47] Bryan: Honestly, I think that

[00:53:49] Christina: I was going to say that’s the

[00:53:50] Bryan: one with little geniuses

[00:53:54] Brett: literal geniuses guide to anal sex.

[00:53:59] Christina: genius [00:54:00] has got it, which is in Brett’s terms. If you’re not gay, don’t do it first. Um,

[00:54:06] Brett: If you have, if you have other options, explore other avenues, literally.

[00:54:10] Christina: explore their holsters

[00:54:12] Bryan: with lots of other holes.

[00:54:19] So, I mean, I am actually trying to get work to get me a new Mac book pro the situation there is that work is like still working through how they make apple sustainable than PCs. They know what the numbers are about. Like, we know we can talk about what IBM has done and so on and so forth, but that’s at a scale that we’re not out

[00:54:40] Christina: yet.

[00:54:40] Right. Right. And, and also I was going to say, if you do get them to pay for it, make sure you don’t mention the issues you’ve been having.

[00:54:49] Bryan: I absolutely will. Not, none of them was to this podcast, so they should, um, because this podcast is amazing and it’s so nerdy and literally everybody worked with his merits [00:55:00] and it’s the best.

[00:55:01] But yeah. So that’s currently my goal. I, I guess if I have to, I can just have them swap this out, but then what if the next one has the same problem?

[00:55:10] Brett: Yeah, well, and that’s the thing is like I went and priced out a MacBook pro that would meet my standards,

[00:55:18] Bryan: Yeah.

[00:55:18] Brett: to, to be a step up for me. I’m looking at four grand and, and I need, I need a shirt that says that this isn’t an ad. This isn’t just an M one issue. And that if I spent for a grant and I’m going to get a machine that does not suffer from these issues,

[00:55:37] Bryan: Yeah.

[00:55:38] Brett: I need, can I get a truck?

[00:55:39] Well, they loan me one for awhile.

[00:55:41] Bryan: No.

[00:55:42] Brett: what I’ll do. I’ll get work me a new M one MacBook pro I’ll use it just enough to decide if it works, because I refuse to use an Oracle provision machine as a daily driver. Um, their, their provisioning is, um, [00:56:00] brutal. What’s the word I’m looking for? D D draconian. Draconian man, that took me a second to grab, but, um, maybe I could use it as a free trial.

[00:56:15] Bryan: Well, Brett, you are literally a business. You can work with like apple business people

[00:56:25] Brett: What does that

[00:56:26] mean?

[00:56:27] Bryan: uh, you can get things like on, they do leasing that way. They do all sorts of interesting things. Um, I know that’s how, like I know Casey and Marco have always done a bunch of things that way with the computers that they’ve gotten, um, often is to work through the, the, the business folks, because they have a whole bunch of set things that they can do that like you can’t do if you’re just like on the ground.

[00:56:49] Brett: I have to have a business like licensed, like registered? Cause I have always operated under the name. Brett’s hertfordshire.com, but I’ve never registered as any kind of [00:57:00] LLC or any.

[00:57:00] Bryan: I

[00:57:01] Christina: don’t know. They might, they might ask, but in most cases. Okay. So I know if you want to get a business bank account, you need to have like the tax ID number, but for tax purposes, if you’re a one person, LLC, it is actually no different, like you don’t technically need to have like the, the, you know, business license thing.

[00:57:20] Um, so probably not, if you’re saying you do business under that thing, if you’re a single personality, you probably don’t. I know that

[00:57:29] my business account, I have to register for things.

[00:57:31] Brett: name. So.

[00:57:32] Christina: Oh, well then yeah. Then there you go. Cause I was going to say, cause, cause that my LLC, that I had to do when I did, um, the times podcast last year and it was enough of a thing that I was like, okay, I have to have a business account.

[00:57:43] I need to separate some stuff for that. Um, I went through the registration process, but I really literally only had to register. So that I could get the business banking account. Like that was literally the only reason that I did that because I wanted to get, um, uh, I didn’t want it. I wanted like a separate, [00:58:00] separate

[00:58:01] Bryan: banking account

[00:58:04] All About Neo

[00:58:04] Brett: What are we going to talk about? Now? We have, like, we have two minutes left. I haven’t, I started watching Frasier again last night because I was so tired.

[00:58:15] Christina: you’re so tired.

[00:58:16] Bryan: You’re Like

[00:58:17] Brett: else made sense.

[00:58:18] Christina: you’re like, I can’t watch Nancy sell drugs on weeds anymore. Cause she’s so bad at

[00:58:22] it.

[00:58:23] Brett: And even we’re, we’ve been doing, like, we’ve been watching new girl, just for shits and giggles, but even that was like too much for me last night. So we just started watching Frasier again from episode one. I don’t think I’ll continue. I don’t think I’ll watch the whole thing again. I don’t have the fascination with it that my girlfriend does, but it is a good comfort show, but I haven’t seen a good movie for, I can’t remember the last good movie I saw.

[00:58:52] Christina: Yeah, I really want to see Spiderman, but I’m not, I don’t want to go to the movie theater

[00:58:55] Brett: I have heard, I’ve heard good things about Spider-Man.

[00:58:58] Christina: as a vibe, but I’m just, I’m afraid to go to the movie [00:59:00] theater like that. This is the, this is the fucked up thing. I’m like, if I weren’t going, you know, to, to visit my parents and a baby, then it’d be one thing. But because I am like,

[00:59:08] Brett: dude. W

[00:59:10] Bryan: oh yeah,

[00:59:10] Brett: movie theater. And I realized like, I really kind of wanted to see doing in the theater after watching it on my home Um, but I didn’t want to go to a theater badly enough to do that, but dune was a good movie though. I still

[00:59:25] Christina: Yeah.

[00:59:26] Brett: a good movie.

[00:59:27] Christina: Okay. You have. Okay. So you’ve seen

[00:59:28] Bryan: June also, literally next week we get the matrix resurrection. Yes. And you can watch it at home because it’s on HBO max.

[00:59:36] Brett: have high.

[00:59:39] Bryan: So here’s what I would say. My literal favorite critic at large Emily Vanderwerff, it’s really fricking fun and a good time. And many people will love it. Many people will hate it.

[00:59:50] Christina: Yeah. I saw Emily’s um, uh, tweets and I was like, okay, well that makes me feel better. How ever, um, uh, [01:00:00] it’s still one of those things where I’m like, I don’t know, like, you know what I mean?

[01:00:05] Like, look, I love the original, it’s a great film. Um, it’s fun. The second two are fucking guard, hot, garbage, and anybody who tries to pretend otherwise is kidding themselves. Like

[01:00:18] Brett: worse though. Like the second

[01:00:20] Bryan: yes. Was it,

[01:00:23] Brett: I still found It was kind of fun. Like I didn’t end it and think, oh my God, that was amazing. Not like the first one, but it wasn’t until the third one that they really lost me.

[01:00:34] Bryan: to be honest, I don’t really remember the second and third one just tells you how much, how good is.

[01:00:39] Christina: Well, this is my point, right? It, which to me is honestly that the marker of a truly bad movie when you don’t even remember it, like, honestly, like,

[01:00:46] like.

[01:00:46] Brett: I don’t remember it at all. I just remember not hating the second one as much as the third one, I can’t remember anything about them.

[01:00:53] Christina: No. And I would agree with that. The third one was definitely worth it and it got progressively worse, but this was one of those situations where I was just like, I remember, I [01:01:00] remember, I think I was drunk when I saw the third one in the theater. And even that wasn’t enough. Um, and, and my drunk, I mean, like we were pre-gaming in the car before we went to the movie theater and then we brought beers in with us and we were not people.

[01:01:14] And we were not the only people drinking in that movie theater.

[01:01:17] Bryan: This is amazing. Have you all seen the verge, uh, interview with galleries and carry a mosh? Oh my God. It’s so funny.

[01:01:25] It’s so funny.

[01:01:25] Brett: laughs about crypto

[01:01:27] Bryan: Oh my God.

[01:01:28] Yeah.

[01:01:28] Brett: and FTS or.

[01:01:29] Christina: Yes, yes, yes. Alex asks you questions and Carrie and she’s just,

[01:01:36] Bryan: oh my God, she can’t stand it.

[01:01:37] She’s like, well, whatever, like she’s like, I’m going to do it. Yadda does. He’s she’s so chill. Like she’s so chill. Like y’all, don’t leave.

[01:01:47] I love it. I want to be his best friend. Like I just want to hang out with Keanu Reeves talk very slowly about

[01:01:55] Christina: things. Did you see that a Buzzfeed asked them about sad Yano?

[01:01:59] Bryan: Oh

[01:01:59] Christina: [01:02:00] no. He was just hungry.

[01:02:05] Bryan: That’s so relatable. Relatable.

[01:02:09] Christina: I’m going to say, I used to have, I used to, I used to have a, um, a thing, um, on, uh, my desk at mashville for many years, our, our, uh, our art director at the time were very, were very hurt.

[01:02:21] Our directors, like we had names and stuff and he made me like, he, he printed out a sat counter thing and cut it out and like put it so that it was on like, kind of like the top of like my kind of cube area in the office. So he was like, kind of perched on my, on my work area where I just had like a sad count of sitting, like perched on my desk.

[01:02:40] It was great. Um, But I love that, that he was just hungry. Like that’s honestly, he, I love him. He’s honestly, who would’ve thought that he would have been like the most like, of all of like the nineties hunk, like actors, he would wind up being like the most relatable and the most nice. And it was chilling.

[01:02:57] The one that we’re all like, Aw, [01:03:00] we love you.

[01:03:01] Bryan: Yeah. Literally everything that man does is, I mean, can we talk about one of the great

[01:03:07] Christina: movies? Yeah. Speed is a great movie and his chemistry with, with, uh, Sandra Bullock. So fucking good.

[01:03:14] Bryan: Sandra Bullock used to do the best movies. Remember the nap?

[01:03:18] Christina: The net was,

[01:03:19] Bryan: oh my God.

[01:03:20] This terrible.

[01:03:20] Brett: I never had anything good to say about Sandra Bullock until she started doing comedies.

[01:03:25] Christina: Well, yeah. Yeah. I mean, she’s a comedy

[01:03:27] actress. Um,

[01:03:30] Brett: It was her first movie. It was hilarious.

[01:03:33] Christina: um, but I, do you remember, uh, while you were sleeping, uh, with Peter Gallagher and. Well, it was the one at the net, which is terrible, but also amazing.

[01:03:44] Bryan: Exactly. It’s so bad. Remember all of them, like those bad internet movies, which like, we still have that internet movies, but like, that was the greatest time because it was so bad, but also we were so starved

[01:03:57] Christina: well, the fact that she was a hacker on a [01:04:00] Mac at 1994 tells you everything you need to know about, like how that, and that was like, she’s hitting a high symbol and, they, they filmed some of it out, like one of the macros expos in Boston or something like the inseam, I believe.

[01:04:14] Um, yeah, but, but the proposal, good movie. Um, great, great Senator book comedy. Um, and, um, what are the, what? What’s the congeniality?

[01:04:26] Brett: I like miss congenial.

[01:04:28] Bryan: that’s a good film.

[01:04:30] Brett: I mean, I wouldn’t say it was a good film, but it was, it was,

[01:04:32] Christina: Well, it’s funny, right? Like, you know, she she’s no rose barren, but like she’s, there’s similar, you know what I mean? Like, I think it was Baroness funnier, but yeah,

[01:04:42] Bryan: she’s done.

[01:04:42] So one of the things that’s so interesting about Bullock is she really has been in all types of movies in a way that most people like she, like, that’s not, doesn’t happen as much anymore,

[01:04:53] Christina: but like

[01:04:55] Bryan: from, to gravity to the blind side. [01:05:00] Yeah, absolutely. 50 films. He started over the prince of Egypt. I didn’t even know if he was in the prince of Egypt, which is a

[01:05:09] Christina: musical ever.

[01:05:10] Yeah. Katzenberg. That was, that was, uh, like their, their third animated or fourth animated, uh, um, Dreamworks. Yeah. Yes,

[01:05:19] Bryan: she was Miriam. So, uh, the older sister of Moses.

[01:05:23] Christina: Oh, right, right, right. Okay. Okay. Um, yeah, no, I, um, I’m a big, big, big fan, um, of a piano big fan of, of Sandra Bullock in her comedies. Although I love speed.

[01:05:36] I think speed is just a fun movie speed too. Again, hot garbage. I don’t remember it. Other than seeing it in the theater. I was in like eighth grade and I was like, this is trash. I remember that was a bad summer. Cause it was that. And it was, um, and it was Batman and Robin

[01:05:54] Bryan: and Robin that’s the one with the

[01:05:56] Christina: nipples.

[01:05:57] Right. But the nipples with Alicia [01:06:00] Silverstone, who I love so much, but who, um, she was like 20 and going through like the period that girls go in where you do not want to be in a skin tight suit, like it’s just not, it’s just not the right time to be wearing that costume. Um, and, and, uh, yeah, the nipples, I mean, Clooney’s apologized for it and um, I think it’s why Clooney still has a Korean.

[01:06:23] Is, he was very funny about it and it was like very apologetic. Um, and it was so Clooney about it that it mean, you know, and, and honestly, if you think about it, like he probably would have been like the perfect Bruce Wayne in a better movie. You know what I mean? It’s a kind of is Bruce Wayne

[01:06:38] Bryan: and now we’re getting Edward from Twilight,

[01:06:41] Christina: which I’m so here for.

[01:06:44] Um, he’s so hot and, and I mean, he’s genuinely so hot and I actually I’m like, you know what, I’m here for, for Robert Pattinson as, as the Batman, like Ben Affleck was never about it. I’m very happy. I’d like him again [01:07:00] because Jennifer Lopez has rehabilitated him completely in my, in my mind. Um, because she’s magic I do love them together.

[01:07:07] But, um, his whole thing with Batman. What is this bullshit? Like, like there’s there, there, there, there are three Batman, Batman to me. There’s there’s Michael Keaton. There’s Christian bale. And, um, presumably now there will be Robert Pattinson depending on, on how it works out.

[01:07:25] Bryan: Okay. So have y’all ever seen, um, the little Twitter video that it’s called?

[01:07:31] How many Batman do we need? Okay,

[01:07:36] so I’m going to, so Andrew Barth Feldman, who was the, uh, who was like the first like actual, um, dear Evan Hansen to play like the Rite aid. He was like 16 and he got played on Broadway. He did this video. Let’s go to how many Batman do we need? Like on Twitter. [01:08:00] And it is the funniest thing.

[01:08:01] So I’m going to drop it into Skype. So folks who watch it if we want.

[01:08:04] Brett: I found it.

[01:08:05] Bryan: Okay, you got it? Yeah. Um, it is just the funniest little video, um, because yeah,

[01:08:15] Christina: we need to have a whole other podcast episode just talking about dear Evan Hansen. At some point

[01:08:20] Bryan: we absolutely could have a dear Evan Hanson episode. My goodness, that show I haven’t watched the movie.

[01:08:26] I don’t watch it.

[01:08:27] Brett: I might need a week off if you guys want to have a

[01:08:29] Christina: Yeah, we could totally do that. I was going to say cause cause um, yeah, uh, I have my own personal like weirdness about that because, um, uh, I used to work with one of the, one of the producers and um, I saw in previews the day after they laid off 10% of the company, which was a weird, which, so it’s tied up in a lot of like hard stuff.

[01:08:52] Um, but, but, but it’s also it’s it’s uh, it’s uh, it works on Broadway in a certain sense. Although PubMatic has held the movie that you [01:09:00] have to watch them because the movie is just, wow.

[01:09:05] Bryan: Wow. It’s

[01:09:06] Christina: just a lot. It’s just a lot. So that’ll be a future over tired when Brett takes off where we’re Brian and I will just talk about, um, speaking of like bad movies, although I would say it is one of those, you will remember it.

[01:09:17] It’s like a, it’s not like from Justin to Kelly bad, but it is one of those, like, you will remember that you’re like, yeah, that was not good. Like, it is, it is like so bad that it’s, unmemorable like the last two matrix movies.

[01:09:30] Brett: Speaking of, wow. I was filling out show notes and I decided I would throw in a link to live journal that is possibly the worst website, like just from usability, like a.

[01:09:43] Bryan: Well, yeah, because the

[01:09:44] Christina: Russians bought it like 15 years

[01:09:46] Bryan: ago.

[01:09:46] Brett: can’t open this search in Firefox at all. I was going to look for Brian Guffey on, on live journal and the search box doesn’t open until you open it in like Chrome or safari.

[01:09:56] then every link you click opens a new tab. Like [01:10:00] everything is open and a new tab. then you go into these posts and they’re from today, but they look like they were written on angel fire.

[01:10:10] Bryan: Yes

[01:10:12] Brett: How does this even still exist?

[01:10:14] Christina: because the Russians bought

[01:10:14] Bryan: it and they’re running ads on it. Yeah.

[01:10:18] Brett: Okay.

[01:10:19] Bryan: Investment man. Wow.

[01:10:21] Brett: But people are writing here.

[01:10:23] Bryan: Yeah. I’ve used really wild that people are still there. But the only thing that I can say about a good thing about life dream is where I discovered fanfiction,

[01:10:33] Brett: Oh, steamy.

[01:10:35] Bryan: honestly, but like specifically Harry Potter fan. And not even like all like slash pick though, I have to say, like, I am a true Draco Harry spam,

[01:10:49] but like it was, and I just actually recently started going back to some favorite fiction because it’s, everything was taking routing. Uh, there was a great article in slate, which I will also link [01:11:00] to, which is called the best Harry Potter, um, book isn’t even written by Jake out.

[01:11:07] Christina: Yeah. Fair fair. No, it is interesting.

[01:11:10] Um, we could do a whole episode just about all the machinations that ha all the things that happened in live journal. Cause Fred told us at six apart and then six apart, it fell apart and then they

[01:11:20] Bryan: sold it to the Russians.

[01:11:23] Christina: Yeah, same, same. And, um, that is also how I met, uh, Neil. And, um, uh, do you remember the original box.com, which was their, uh, their, their blogging service that was kind of live journal, but it’s supposed to be for adult. And then they sold the domain to obviously box. Um, but yeah, uh, that, yeah. Um, but it’s, um, anyway, uh, the whole thing was a mess, but the fan fixed up when they, when six-part bought them, they, it was kind of like when toddlers got rid of porn, [01:12:00] but we more dramatic and and weirdly way lower stakes.

[01:12:06] Like honestly, if you really think about it, like there were still plenty of places that people could create communities around fanfiction. and, and people had, because life Turner was always open source, you know, created their own kind of instances. Uh, we’re getting rid of the porn honestly way bigger deal.

[01:12:23] Uh, but, but the internet obviously reacted way more harshly to the, to the live journal. Uh, um, uh fanfic um, debacle, which because 2007 or something,

[01:12:33] Bryan: I don’t know.

[01:12:34] Brett: did, did Tumblr actually get rid of.

[01:12:37] Bryan: Yes.

[01:12:38] Brett: What is Tumblr gallery dot X, Y, Z.

[01:12:43] Christina: I don’t

[01:12:44] Brett: I believe someone offloaded, like I did a search for Tumblr porn and, and I got these links. I got none with big cox.tumbler.com, but the link actually goes to Tumblr [01:13:00] gallery.xyz, which appears to be like someone saved all the porn from Tumblr.

[01:13:06] Bryan: well

[01:13:07] Christina: that’s I see this. Okay, Nice. Um, but yeah, this was like, like two or three years ago, uh, when Yahoo still owned it, they, and it’s like dumb. It’s like

[01:13:18] Brett: Well, I remember it happening. Yeah.

[01:13:21] Christina: well, no, no, no, no. They, this was like two, three years ago. They got rid of it, but they actually got rid of it. They didn’t get rid of like, like people drawing naked people, like, it was, know, not, not even just like, like, like, like big cocks, but like.

[01:13:34] Drawings of like naked breasts, which okay. it was like, you, you, you do realize the entire reason that tumbler exists is because of like that it had the traffic. It has because of porn. I think I even wrote something when, when, um, when Yahoo bought Tumblr and like 2012 or something, which was like, Marissa does, no, this is just a porn site.

[01:13:53] Right? Like I think that, that was, I think that that was what my, um, article was, um, uh, for [01:14:00] Mashable, which now I can’t find because they nerfed archives The archives are still there, but like, I can’t Google it because they changed the slugs. And then they, they did the archiving, they got rid of any of the paragraphs spacing or HTML from the post.

[01:14:17] it’s terrible. And then, because they changed the URL, it’s difficult to even find the original in the, um, archive because they did a redirect. Anyway, I can’t find it, but I do, I do recall writing something where I was like, she does realize that this is just a porn site, right?

[01:14:36] Bryan: Yeah, absolutely.

[01:14:37] Which is like, I mean, and now Matt Mullenweg owns it, which is

[01:14:41] Christina: wild $2

[01:14:43] Bryan: million. Yeah. like I’m like so mad, like be a champion for the gay community and give us tumbler quarterback.

[01:14:50] Christina: Totally, totally. And he’s like,

[01:14:52] Bryan: no, honestly, like really surprised Twitter porn still definitely

[01:14:58] Christina: like 8 [01:15:00] 24. And still definitely think as long as

[01:15:01] Brett: Is it?

[01:15:01] Christina: account.

[01:15:02] And I said, yeah, as long as you mark your account and that’s at w so it won’t show up in search results, but like, you can still follow accounts and like, they’re like, hell

[01:15:09] Bryan: yeah,

[01:15:09] Brett: I didn’t know that. I feel like I shouldn’t have.

[01:15:13] Bryan: Also now I hope all of those Twitter people like those, especially those accounts, that aggregate stuff, here’s the deal that need to sign up for Twitter blue, then we can upload it.

[01:15:29] Brett: Nylon and spandex rubber frog.tumbler.com. There’s there’s a wealth of, of buried borderline pornographic images on these Tumblr. Uh ripoffs anyway, um, monster cock shemale, not the, not the title of this episode, but maybe next week.

[01:15:50] Christina: Maybe a future episode. That’d be cool.

[01:15:54] Bryan: That’s amazing. This has been phenomenal. Um, and it’s [01:16:00] always wonderful to spend time with both of you.

[01:16:02] Brett: I love your voice so much. Brian, you can come and just talk to me anytime.

[01:16:07] Bryan: Gladly we’d be happy to, well, you can hear more of my voice now I now have a podcast that will read that the podcast is out now it’s called unsolicited fatties talk back. Um, and it’s available everywhere. Podcasts are So check it out. We an advice column just facts about garlic are about, or for fat people and then like put a fat liberation lens on it.

[01:16:32] So it’s pretty cool.

[01:16:33] Brett: Yeah, that was, that was to be released last time you were on the show. So yeah, everyone can go check it out now.

[01:16:40] Bryan: Yeah. We just dropped our fourth episode, which, uh, downloads like so fascinated by downloads about podcasts like wholism, because that thing was more than like that one got more traction than all the rest of our podcasts combined, which is pretty wild. Also more people listen on Spotify than apple podcast to our podcast.[01:17:00]

[01:17:00] with the rest of is interesting. two to one

[01:17:05] Christina: C, C, this is why apple shouldn’t have slept on podcasts for as long as they did, because it allowed like people to like, get rid of the RSS feed and go into their like

[01:17:17] Bryan: exclusive walled garden. Shit. Yeah, that’s true.

[01:17:23] Brett: I, um, I’m, uh, I’m dropping a Rick roll into our show notes

[01:17:29] Bryan: I love

[01:17:30] Brett: for anyone who gets, um, a little curious.

[01:17:39] Bryan: This is perfect. So

[01:17:46] Brett: Alright, you’re welcome.

[01:17:48] Bryan: thank you.

[01:17:49] Brett: This has gone off the rails at this point, but all right, so everyone needs to go check out fatties talk. Uh, what’s it called? Patty stopped back

[01:17:57] Bryan: unsolicited, colon, [01:18:00] fatties talk back.

[01:18:00] Brett: And Christina have a great couple of weeks off.

[01:18:04] Christina: Thank you. You too, Brett. And uh, everybody happy, a happy

[01:18:07] Bryan: new year.

[01:18:08] Brett: Hopefully I will have slept again, uh, before we talk again, but, uh, yeah, I have no idea what, what the next couple of days hold for me.

[01:18:17] Bryan: Yeah. I hope you take care of yourself. Brett,

[01:18:21] Brett: You guys too great talking to you.

[01:18:23] Christina: great talking with you.

[01:18:25] Bryan: Get some sleep.

[01:18:26] Brett: Get some sleep Christiana.