Nathan: I've always appreciated when someone will share real numbers because it gives so much context. So for example, I was thinking that I wanted to write a book, you know, like the first book. And there were these two designers who didn't know each other and pure by chance they published like self published ebooks on design on the same day in March 2012. Nathan: My version of paying that forward is that I've always shared real numbers. Because my idea is that if someone else is building a software company, they might be like, oh man, we're really struggling with churn. They can actually just go find 25,000 MRR. That's what ConvertKit