Just

tell us about the day that Joe died, where you were what you do you heard. It's

really weird thinking about Jo's murder because I've not dealt with it I really know that that is the case I've never processed it I've never grieved I've literally just put my head down and thought right just keep going just keep going and when I think back to that day and it feels so long ago in some respects but then also really recent in other respects and it was during the Euros the football was on so we were at home my partner just had an operation on a foot so we're sat in a chair with a foot up like Jim Royal and we were about to watch the footy but I'd taken my car in for a service and I thought I was trying to be healthy not easy anymore again in this job Rory very unhealthy lifestyle so I ran down to get my car from the garage and then I got a phone call telling me what happened and it's just impossible to describe that feeling and it's impossible to describe how your life can change like that and everything that's happened to me since I'm just doing it I don't even know if I'm feeling it but I'm just doing it and I've never had any counseling about it. And maybe I never will. And maybe that's fine. And I keep thinking, well, I can get to a year, then I can get to two years. Then I thought, I'm doing all right. I can get to five years. And it's eight and a half years since Joe was killed. And now I'm at a point where I can get to 10 years. And then we'll see where we are after that. it's just really bizarre and again going back you know talking about death all the time at the moment which is really hard emotionally on lots of levels and hearing about horrible deaths but i suppose what it's made me think about is with every death there is a loss and it's like an onion isn't it at the center of the onion is the loss so we lose someone we love and then there are the layers around that loss and some of that might be pain it might be shock it might be someone being very poorly and ill it might be a tragic accident and then you've got murder and where does murder fit into that someone actually wanted to kill another person and wanted to kill a specific person in this instance. So all that is like somewhere around in my brain and maybe at some point I'll deal with it. And do you know what? Maybe I never will. And maybe I'll just keep going and trying to do the best I can.