Facing Struggles: Leadership, Holiness, and Personal Wilderness

I sat down with Luke Lezon and Will Chung to explore how Gen Z and Millennials are wrestling with identity, dignity, and discipleship in a rapidly shifting culture. These young pastors are preaching into cities like Orlando and LA—transient places that offer gospel-sending opportunities—and we unpacked the dangers of comfort culture and over-therapeutic narratives. We talked about how the call to follow Christ includes self-denial, repentance, and mission. Each of us shared stories of wilderness seasons, pastoral burnout, and the deep healing required to lead from wholeness. This is a deep dive into the joys and costs of courageous ministry today. I pray it encourages you — whatever context you’re in.

In This Episode

• [02:00] Identity vs. Dignity: Will’s Pastoral Lens
• [05:30] Cultural Pressures and Fragile Worth
• [06:30] Luke on the “Identity Fair” and a Better Story
• [07:45] Gospel Ministry in a Collapsing Secularism
• [08:45] Ministering in Transient Cities: Orlando & LA
• [10:00] Mission Field Mindsets and “Sending Capacity”
• [12:00] Five-Year Discipleship Windows
• [14:00] Lies This Generation Believes About God
• [17:30] The Overcorrection of Self-Care & Gospel Rest
• [21:00] Rest vs. Replenishment: Jefferson Bethke’s Shift
• [23:00] Gen Z’s Pain Tolerance & Hunger for Mission
• [24:00] Will’s 2020 Breakdown: Performing to Be Enough
• [29:00] Depression and Identity
• [31:00] Luke’s Story: Betrayal, Leadership, and God’s Timing
• [35:00] “Cut Robes, Don’t Kill Kings”: Leading Through Hurt
• [38:00] Repentance + Healing = Transformation
• [41:00] Therapy, Trauma, and the Gospel of Repentance
• [45:00] What Christian Therapy Is—and What It’s Not
• [47:00] Courage in the Pulpit: What It Looks Like Now
• [50:00] Don’t Be Lazy with the Word: Clarity Over Comfort
• [52:00] Hermeneutical Bubbles and Pastoral Cowardice
• [54:00] What the Church Needs to Repent Of (Apathy)
• [56:00] The Radical Disciple and the Lost Mission
• [58:00] Stop Selling Out for Ministry Success
• [01:01:00] Hearing from God, Not Social Media
• [01:04:00] Final Words + A Call to Spiritual Fathers

Guest Resources

• Follow Luke
• Luke’s Church
• Follow Will
• Will’s Church

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