You are the first guest of 70 that I've had on the show who's a permaculture expert. Can you briefly describe what is permaculture? How did it come to be real briefly? And how did you get involved in it back in the day? Yeah. Permaculture is a design system. It was developed in the late 70s, early 80s in Australia by this guy, Bill Mollison. He was a trapper and a logger and a jajakable trades. So actually the entire design system, as he explained in his autobiography, it came to him in a flash. Like he saw the whole thing all at once and saw how he had to

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