In the early days, as you don't really have a built-out platform, you just have a concept that you'd love to have one. You actually want a lot of collaboration because the customer, who is the product engineer, if we can call them that, needs stuff now. And the platform team can't be saying, well, we just, we have our own priorities. We're going to go work on that stuff, right? Like you want them to be served as the customer.

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