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In the absence of as banning things, we have people self censoring. And that's the chilling. If you say something like it's illegal to teach about critical race theory, what are you going to do? You might be the kind of person who feels like taking it on and really carving out a thing that you think is critical race theory,. not teaching it. But you might also be a person who just says a, not going o even bother to teach about race at all.

Jeannie Suk Gersen is the John H. Watson, Jr. Professor of Law at Harvard Law School and a contributing writer at The New Yorker. She writes widely about the law and its impact on society.

In this week’s conversation, Jeannie Suk Gersen and Yascha Mounk discuss the value of robust debate in law school classrooms, the perils of eroding due process in the name of progress, and the legitimacy of the Supreme Court.

This transcript has been condensed and lightly edited for clarity.

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