The Absolute and the Relative Truth

Stephan Bodian is a teacher in the nondual wisdom tradition of Zen, Dzogchen, and Advaita Vedanta and the founder and director of the annual School for Awakening, an intensive six-month program of exploration and study. His offerings are noted for their humor, warmth, spontaneity, and intimacy and combine direct pointers, lively dialogues, silent sitting, and guided self-inquiry. He’s the author of several books, including Wake Up Now: A Guide to the Journey of Spiritual Awakening and Beyond Mindfulness: The Direct Approach to Lasting Peace, Happiness, and Love. Stephan spent a decade practicing Zen intensively as a monk but left the monastery because he sensed that the rigorous practice of meditation was obscuring the truth he was seeking. After studying Dzogchen for several years, he met his guru, Jean Klein, a European teacher of Advaita Vedanta, who told him to stop meditating and instead discover the meditator. Shortly after meeting Jean, he had a profound awakening to his true identity as timeless presence. After Jean’s death, Stephan met Adyashanti, and in 2001 Adya gave him Dharma transmission and invited him to teach. Trained as a psychotherapist, Stephan also offers individual spiritual counseling and mentoring sessions to people throughout the world. His approach blends direct, experiential, nondual wisdom with the insights of Western psychology to support students in realizing who they really are while inquiring into the stories and patterns of thinking and behaving that continue to cause suffering. Website: stephanbodian.org Other books: Meditation For Dummies, w/Audio CD (Also available in various languages.) Timeless Visions, Healing Voices: Conversations with Men & Women of the Spirit Discussion of this interview in the BatGap Community Facebook Group. Summary and Transcript of this interview. First BatGap interview with Stephan. Interview recorded July 11, 2021 YouTube Video Chapters: 00:00:00 - Introduction to Buddha at the Gas Pump 00:05:20 - A Shift in the Locus of Identity 00:10:00 - The Vastness and Dream States 00:15:05 - Roshi's Uninhibited Behavior and the Fall of the Center 00:20:18 - Bodhidharma's Precepts and Acting in Integrity 00:25:13 - The Ugly Truth and Confrontational Behavior 00:30:15 - Dealing with the Shadow and Integrity 00:35:01 - Narcissism in Spiritual Teachers and the Direct Path 00:39:53 - Awakening and the Role of the Teacher 00:44:51 - The Role of Teachers and the Need for Discernment 00:49:48 - The Impressionability of the Mind 00:54:19 - The Interface Between Science and Spirituality 00:57:59 - The Direct Meeting and Potential for Transmission 01:01:23 - The Pitfalls of Spiritual Teachers and Sex 01:05:31 - Boundary-crossing and predatory behavior 01:09:01 - Spiritual Teachers and Dark Triad Qualities 01:12:56 - The Importance of Care in Spiritual Evolution 01:16:34 - Relationships and Higher Callings 01:19:59 - The Literary Invention of Crazy Wisdom 01:23:47 - Compassionate Being and True Crazy Wisdom 01:27:12 - Starting a New University 01:30:43 - The Strange Fit Between Narcissists and Spiritual Teachers 01:34:16 - Embracing Human Relationships 01:37:51 - Giving Power Away and Seeking Enlightenment 01:41:49 - Being Your Own Authority 01:45:11 - The Horse and the Whip 01:48:28 - Different Spiritual Teachers and their Teachings 01:51:57 - The True Guru Within 01:55:49 - The Awakening Journey 01:59:32 - The Role of a Spiritual Teacher 02:03:10 - School for Awakening