i love it when a guest teaches me, you know, about their story, and makes me think about change in a totally different way. So as interviewing tommy caldwell, who you might note he is is an extremely skilled climber. He's considered one of the greatest big wall climbers in the world. And he did it with nine freaking fingers, because he cut off one of his fingers during a wood shopping accident in his garage. It was so intoxicating that since that day he's been chasing that high. Even tried to starve himself once on a climb to see if he could get back there....