it's

in a class of very advanced level course pricing. Is that because that's what the market bears? Is that because it's like 190 chapters? Is that because the deal size and investment size is so big that it substantiates a course that that's expensive? I'm just curious how you've landed on that, how you've tweaked it. Because course pricing is a science in and of itself.

Yeah, no, for sure it really is. I still don't know that I'm 100% confident, even in the current price, to be honest with you, because I know there's people out there selling courses that I know I've been through. I know they're not half as good and they're charging like $5 ,000 for them. It's a weird thing. And there's other people who are giving away their course for free. And that's another interesting thing because if somebody sees two land investing courses, one's free, one is 2,500 bucks, why would they not do the free one? I mean, even if the value is like if the quality is completely different, like they're not going to know, you know, why would they roll the dice on 2 bucks to find out? So I think that kind of thing has made it harder as well. But so back when I first started making this course thing, like I mentioned, I tried to do this monthly subscription model, which I found out didn't make sense at all. It was super annoying because even as I mean, it was a laughably cheap price that I was asking for it and people would, you know, miss payments all the time, got to follow up with them. It's just like, come on, it's not hard, people. So we stopped doing that and changed it to an annual subscription. And that probably worked even worse in terms of people continuing to pay. But when we changed it to that, I think that was when it was, gosh, was the price like $1 ,184, some random annual subscription number. And that was a similar issue though, where once the second year came up, people would like disappear in ghost tests and they wouldn't pay and that kind of thing. So that was when I was like, okay, forget this. I see these other land educators are charging about 2,000 bucks for their courses, a one -time payment. Let's do that. It's working for them. I'll try it here. Yeah. And even today, like, if I were to change the price, I would definitely look at like other land courses and see like, what are they doing? What's working for them? And that would play at least some role in me deciding what it would be. I've tried other stuff with webinar promotions where I bundle all of our courses for like, it ends up being like 3,997 for all the courses, but it's cheaper than if you were to buy them all individually, that kind of thing. So you kind of have this value stack that you do, and that's worked to some degree, but I don't think I've been doing it for long enough to really know for sure. That's another strategy, if you try. I

don't want to read too far into it, but in preparing for today, I was on your website, poking around, homepage, about page, getting into some of the content. I would say that it feels like you're definitely funneling people into your newsletter and a lot of your free content, and then the course must get pitched later on, because I didn't see much about the course. Yeah,

Bill, that's such a great feedback. Well,

I don't know, I'm just curious, is that strategic? Because funneling's a big deal, and you've talked so much about how no one's gonna land on your website and buy a two, three, $4 ,000 course out of the gate, and it makes so much sense to me as I peruse your website in preparation for the day, I'm like, I didn't see much about this expensive course. I saw a lot of stuff about how to get information right now that's gonna help today that's kind of free and value -add. Is there a lot of funneling that goes into it? Are you creating email funnels and and and and buyer funnels for your course or what's been the best process for you as you've grown this over the years? Yeah

that's a great question and appreciate the feedback that's that's good to hear. So yeah for the longest time what I would do is I just had a little WordPress widget that showed up at the end of every single blog post that was basically an ad for the land investing masterclass and people would discover it that way. And I've also got like a couple random auto responder emails or you know, auto, they call it when they subscribe and they get a series of like 25 emails for a year or something like that. But some of those emails mention it, but otherwise that's kind of it. I've also got, I guess, some random podcast pre -roll ads that have aired in the past that kind of mention it. So, but to your point, I mean, I could probably do a better job of just like mentioning it more or giving it better airplay. Other stuff that I'm doing now, which I should probably reevaluate it because I know at least one of them isn't working that well, is instead of just sending them directly to the landing page for the land investing masterclass, one of these things goes to a webinar where they see all about it and that kind of thing. And that is it. Kind of mixed results. It hasn't worked as well as I thought it would have. The other one is a free 5 -day email course where they can kind of learn more about it and kind of overcomes objections and that kind of thing. And I haven't looked at the stats enough to know how well that's working, if at all. But yeah, that's a good point, though. I've got to revisit that to figure out, is that working? I said both of them up less than a year ago. So I just want

to see if we got a check in. from you about high ticket sales. I mean, that's really what I'm drilling down on here is, it's one thing to launch a course for your content for 297. It's another thing to launch a course for 2497. And there's so much we can learn from you who have kind of moved your course up in price throughout the years as you've seen what's working and what's not. And I think there's something to be said for what you're echoing. I don't want to read too far into this, so tell me if I am, but you really do come across as someone who leads with value first and spends more time with the value than you do on creating the perfect funnel, or the perfect landing page, or the perfect metric that backs up the this, the that, and there's something to be said for it. Like, yeah, I'm sure you could be doing better on that, but to your earlier point, there's only so many hours of the day that you can focus on this. You still have to be an active real estate investor to provide that value. You're focusing on those kinds of things. I just think there's a great juxtaposition there that you're kind of uncovering. Like the value you're providing is your focus over a super detailed funnel, maybe

Yeah, yeah, it's really true. And I think like something to know about the real estate investing space online, and this is kind of like harpooned pretty well about bigger pockets over the years, but I think the issue existed before them, but they just kind of did a really good job of creating the mindset. But there's a kind of a, like real estate gurus or educators are almost seen as bad guys. Like these are people who are like, they're a sham. Like they're just trying to scam you out of your money. And you know, they're the enemy kind of thing, which not everybody thinks that, but there is that thought out there. Like as soon as you start offering a course for $2 ,000, oh, I see. You're one of those guys. And I don't want to be seen as one of those guys. To a fault, to the point that they just probably lost me a ton of money over the years. I think that's kind of what subconsciously keeps me from mentioning it more is because I don't want to lead with the sales pitch. I want to lead with like, look how I can help you, you know, and don't, don't even give me anything. You don't have to opt in anything. It's just, it's all here. And, uh, you know, on one hand, I will say, like, a lot of the people that I meet, like, they are, I don't mean to like, be all narcissistic or anything, but like, they love me. Like, like it creates these amazing fans and people that, you know, come up to you and say like, Seth, you changed my life. So like, I love that just from an emotional side. But like financially, like a lot of these people whose lives I've supposedly changed, I've made not a penny from them. And on one hand, it's like, I guess that's fine. On the other hand, it's like, man, but like, they probably would have paid me something if I had just done a better job of like, letting them know that there was an opportunity to. So I don't have that figured out, honestly. I could probably do a lot better at it.