I have a slightly different interpretation on on the betty crocker story, which is they have to do work. Whenever i sort of onei coud and coud invite people in to s your to use your terminology. I don't make it easy. I did some work with ae company where we're inviting a bunch of people to come join class with me. And, you know, the temptation is to make it on an ap click, click, click. You know, are you available for the dates? Can you do it. What do your qualifications? Check. Check. Check. Instant, you know, instant gratification. And we made them write essays, and we actually read the essays, and we made them d so that the people who phoned it in, we could tell and they got rejected immediately. And the people who didn't feel like writing an essay didn't apply. And the people who took the time to actually write a proper essay to say why they wanted to be in the course, those are the ones who got in. We made them do a little extra work. Now we don't have to make it very difficult, but i'm a great believer in putting in a few barriers. So for example, i cohose to leadership summit every year. And i do it from thursday to saturday every year, cause i don't want it to be a business trip, which is the week days, and i dont to be a boon doggle, which is the week end. So i screw your week and your weak end. So you have to really want to be

there. I a destination wedding, right? It's like a destination wedding, exactly. Do you really love me?

And and so i think the idea of of requiring people to do some work. This is a perfect full circle of where we started over coddling, though, instinctively is the right attitude for a parent, which i you know, we want to protect our kids as best we can and give them the best opportunities, et cetera. Every parent wants that. But the question is, are we denying them the joy of work? Are we denying them the importance of effort? And this goes not only to struggle, like, how are you going to solve this problem? Like you fell off the bicycle, you have to get back up, but i think it's sometimes something not necessarily negative, but asking people to do little more. You got to do a little work to feel the joy of what you've produced. In other words, impact doesn't come free. You can't just go buy a pair of tom's shoes and feel like you've done good in the world. Like it doesn't work that way. And i think that's the parenting thing. We don't have to make all the kids refugees onouno and teach themselves how to read, be dropped off three miles from home. That's not what we're talking about here. But if there's an opportunity a kid to put in a little extra effort to get the thing they want. Like, if you save half, we'll match the other half, and then you can have the thing you want. I think there's a there there. And it gets me wondering, perhaps the innovation class that you teach should also be taught to new parents, because that innovation thinking and learning about risk and effort is maybe more than starting ab it's starting a child on a very different path. Every

once in a while, when i'm writing a business book about how do you get other people to take a chance on you in business, wy all of a sudden i start ed to see these principles that just like, this is life, like thiss, this is exactly how i need to be a better parent to my kids. Like, for example, one of the things i found amongst backable people is that they ty, they really tended to surround themselves with a circle. There were always a trusted circle of people around them that they could go to with ideas, that could go to for career advice. And they really nurtured those relationships. Backold people did a really good job with that more often than not.

And you know,

around the time that i was writing this book, i ended up going to the kingdom of buton which butan has always been fascinating to me, because t measure progress in the country based on what they call gross national happiness. So g d p and economic growth, they matter a lot, but that they all feed up into this sort of larger metric around the happiness of their people. And when i was there, i had a chance to spend time with this research team. And this research team has been, theyve been collecting this data now for decades. And i asked em, like, when you'r when you're out there and you're talking to people, is there a single question that you can ask that can give you pretty good sense if somebody happiness? And they said, yesy, as a matter of fact, there is. And the question is, if you were in real trouble right now, who could you call and know with 100 % certainty that person would be there for you? And they believe people who haven't answered t that question much more likely to be happy. But there was a twist. And the twist was, whose list are you on who can call you and know with 100 cent certainty you are going to be there for them? And

they actually feel like if you have an answer to that, you hve an entire likelihood

of being happy. So in other words, it's not a line, it's a circleand it's this idea of a circle that i think we continue to come back to over and over and over again. So, yes, i mean, these principles that we teach for these sort of sometimes overly broad, generic topics like innovation, teach me actin lice.

And on that note. So nice to meet you. Really interesting. Wonderful. If you enjoyed this pudcast, and if youd like to hear more, please subscribe wherever you like to listen to pudcasts. Until then, take care of yourself. Take care of each other.