USB-C Cable Confusion Explained

Universal Serial Bitching

Introduction and Greetings

[00:00:00]

Brett: Hey, you’re listening to Overtired. I am Brett Terpstra, and it’s just me and Christina Warren this morning. How you doing, Christina?

Christina: Doing pretty good. Doing pretty good. Yeah. This is the, this is the OG Overtired configuration.

Brett: right back to basics. Um,

Christina: We do miss you Jeff, though. Ho, ho, ho. Hope that Jeff is having a great holiday with his family.

Brett: we’ll have to have some, uh, gratuitous Wiki K hole that you go down just to, to commemorate the olden days. Um, so yeah, let’s, uh, let’s, let’s do a quick check-in.

Christina’s Health Update

Brett: Um, I’m curious about your health and all of the wildness that’s going on with your spine and whatnot.

Christina: Yeah. Yeah. Um, same. I wanna hear about you too. Um, so, uh, Christina’s cervical spine update, as it were. Um, I am [00:01:00] still waiting to, as we’re recording this, which is like. Uh, three days before Christmas, uh, I’m still waiting to hear from the, uh, hospital to see if I can, when I can get scheduled. Um, insurance has sort of been a pain in the ass, so when I talked to them last week, they were like, we sent them some paperwork.

We’re still waiting for some things back then. I called the insurance company and the, the, uh, like my insurance is like, has like an intermediary service that is supposed to contact the insurance company on your behalf and that person, but like, I can’t contact them directly. And then that person was like, oh, you don’t need pre-authorization.

Go ahead and schedule the surgery. And I’m like, this doesn’t feel right. Um, so, but, but we, we went ahead and we called back the, you know, the, the surgeon, um, his office and they were very nice and we were like. They say that we can get on the books. So I don’t know when that will be. I’m hoping that it will be, you know, like the first week of January, um, or, or, or thereabouts.

Um, but I don’t know. Um, [00:02:00] so I am still kind of in this like limbo stage where I don’t know exactly when I’m gonna have the surgery, except hopefully soon. And, um, and, and for anyone who hasn’t caught up, I, uh, I have a bulging disc on C seven on my cervical spine, and I’m going to get a, um, artificial disc replacement.

Um, so they’re gonna take out the, you know, bulging bone and all that and put in, uh, some synthetic piece and then hopefully that will immediately relieve the, the pain that has been primarily through the left side of, uh, my arm and my shoulder, um, uh, down through my fingers. But it’s been on my right side a little bit too.

So hopefully when that is done, it’ll be a relatively short recovery. Um, I’ll have an early scar and um, I will be, you know, not. Uh, the pain right now, like the levels aren’t terrible, but I’m pretty numb, uh, on my, my, my left arm, my, my right arm, um, uh, or right fingers I guess too, but, but really it’s, it’s, uh, the, the, the left side [00:03:00] that’s the worst.

And traveling. Um, I’m, I’m in Atlanta with my family right now and, you know, kind of doing other things is just not, it’s not great. So, um, hopefully I’ll be getting surgery sooner rather than later. But obviously all that stuff does impact your mental health too, when you’re in pain and, and you, you know, are freaked out too about, you know, like, even though like they do, you know, it, it’s not an uncommon surgery and, and it, and it should be fine, but you know, there’s always these things in the back of your mind.

You’re like, okay, well what if something goes wrong or whatever. So I’m just, I’m looking forward to, um, you know, light at the end of the tunnel, but um, still kind of in a holding pattern with that. So

Brett: Wow. So that scar’s, that scar’s gonna be on your throat.

Christina: Yeah,

Brett: Wow.

Christina: yeah. Like probably like. No, not really. I’m, I mean, I’m hoping that it’ll be, uh, like no, it really won’t be at all.

Brett: I, I, I would like to have it. I can understand why you wouldn’t.

Christina: yeah, I mean, you know, I will obviously, you know, uh, hopefully it’ll be like low enough to be [00:04:00] primarily covered by shirts or other things, although, who knows? ’cause I do like to wear like, lower cut things sometimes. I don’t know. It, it’ll hopefully, you

Brett: I heard chokers are coming back.

Christina: Yeah, I don’t, unfortunately. I think it’s gonna be too, uh, low for that.

Brett: Okay.

Christina: uh, like, it, it’s gonna be, I think like it might hit against my laryn is, is what they say. That’s the other thing too. I might have, you know, some hoarseness after, won’t we permanent? Um, you know, knock on wood.

Um,

Brett: go on Etsy, you can get, um, they’re for BDSM, they’re like neck, uh, they hold your chin up. They’re like posture enhancers. Uh, but they sell them within leather with like corset straps. ’cause they’re like A-B-D-S-M accessory. That would work.

Christina: No, no. Not even once. Uh, not even once. I mean, look, a good group of people who wanna do that, uh, I I will not be wearing a collar of any sort of that sort of thing. Uh, I, I, I don’t, I don’t really wanna, wanna be part [00:05:00] of, uh, one of that, those types of, you know, uh, Harlequin romance novels. ,

Brett’s Sleep and Work Routine

Brett: All right, well, I will go ahead and check in. Um, I, I’m sleeping really well for like two days at a time, and then I’ll have.

A string of like five or six hours of sleep, which isn’t nothing. Um, but it’s not quite enough for me to not feel tired all the time. And two nights of sleep is not enough for me to catch up on sleep. And, um, so I’m kind of, this has been going on for like a year though, so it’s, I’m just kind of, I’m used to it and I’ve learned to operate pretty well on six or seven hours of sleep, even though historically like I need eight and a half.

Um, but I’m doing okay and I get up about four every morning and I start coding and I usually code from like four to noon, so an eight [00:06:00] hour workday, uh, with a breakfast somewhere in there. And, um, I’ve made really good progress. Marked is, as far as I can tell, ready to go wide with the beta. Um. I think I’ve solved every bug that’s been reported so far.

I only have about a hundred testers right now, um, but I’m gonna open it up, uh, try to get maybe a thousand testers for a couple weeks and then go for a live release. The biggest thing that I’m running into is problems with getting the, like free trial and the purchase mechanisms working, which is the exact same thing that’s holding up NV Ultra right now.

Um, so if I can figure it out for Mark, I can port it to NV Ultra. I can have two apps out there making money, hopefully never have to get a job again. Um, I’m teamed up right now with Dan Peterson, formerly of One Password. Um, and we’re [00:07:00] working on some iOS apps and. And, uh, apex. My, my, all my Universal markdown processor is, it’s coming along really well.

I’ve, I’ve put it out there. Um, I’ve talked to John Gruber a little bit about it. He’s gonna give it more of a workout and get back to me. Um, but I think, I think it’s getting to a point where I would be comfortable integrating it into Mark and even talking to some other, uh, apps about using it as their default processor, um, and kind of alleviating some of the issues people run into with, uh, differences in syntax.

Um, I. I, I, I talked to Devon, think, uh, Eric from Devon think about using it. ’cause they use multi markdown right now, uh, which has a lot of cool features, but is not [00:08:00] really in sync with what most of the web is using these days. Um, so I talked to them about it and they’re like, oh, we had the exact same idea and we’re almost done with our own universal processor.

Um, and theirs is gonna output like RTF and things that I don’t need apex to do. ’cause you can just pipe apex into panoc and do everything you need. So anyway, I’m, I’m tired. I’m, I’m in good spirits. I. I’m dealing fine with winter. My, I’m alone on Christmas, which is gonna be weird. Um, my family’s outta town.

Elle is house sitting I’ll, I’ll go visit Elle, but most of the day I’m gonna be like by myself on Christmas and I don’t drink anymore. And I, I don’t, I don’t know how that’s gonna go yet. Um, initially I thought, oh, that’s fine. I like being alone. But then, [00:09:00] then the idea of like, not having anyone to talk to you on Christmas day started to feel a little depressing.

Christina: Yeah. Yeah. Um, but, um, hopefully, um, when, when will, uh, when will I’ll be back from, from house sitting. How long is, uh, are, are they going to be

Brett: I think. I think the people, the, the house owners come back Thursday or Friday.

Christina: Okay.

Brett: Then we’re gonna take off and go up to Minneapolis to hang out with her family for a weekend. So, I don’t know. It’ll, it’s gonna be fine. It’s gonna be fine. We’re gonna like cook on Christmas Eve and, and have leftovers on Christmas day.

It’ll be fine.

Christina: Yeah, yeah. Well, but, but it, but, but that is weird. Like, I’m sure like to be, you know, not, not, not, not with like your usual crew, but, um, [00:10:00] especially without the alcohol there. But that’s probably a good thing too.

Brett: Yeah, I guess. Um, I will have all the cats. I’ll be fine. I have to take care of the dog too.

Christina: Have, have you heard any updates, like, um, I guess, um, about when you were, you know, you were in the hospital a few times over the last year with, with various things. Did you ever get any definitive update on what that was?

Brett: On which one? I have so many symptoms. Which one are we talking about?

Christina: Well, I guess I, I guess when you, you know, you’ve had to be like hospitalized or

Brett: The pancreatitis.

Christina: had the pancreatitis.

Brett: the, the fact that it hasn’t happened again since I stopped drinking, um, really does indicate that it was entirely alcohol that was causing the problem. Um, so yeah, I’m just, I’m never gonna drink again. That’s fine. It’s, it’s all fine. Um, I did, I did get approved to get back on Medicaid.

Um, so [00:11:00] yeah, I haven’t gotten the paperwork in the mail yet. Uh, but my old card should just start working and I’ll be able to, my, my new doctor wants a whole bunch more tests, including an MRI of my pituitary gland. Um. Like testosterone tests and stuff that I guess is more specific to what she thinks might be going on with me.

Um, but now I can, I can actually get those tests That would’ve been just a huge out-of-pocket expense over the last couple months. So I’m excited. I’m excited to be back on Medicaid. I wish everyone could have Medicaid.

Christina: Yeah, that would be really nice. That would be really nice if, if, if we had systems like that available, um, for everyone. Um, but. Instead, you know, if they’re, like, if you have really great health, I mean, you, you pointed those out. Like you have really great health insurance if you [00:12:00] can prove that you, you know, make absolutely no money.

Um, but, but that opens up so many other, you know, issues that most people aren’t lucky enough to be able

Brett: right. Yeah, totally.

Christina: right.

Brett: All right, well do you, okay, first topic.

USB-C Cable Confusion

Brett: How much do you know about USBC cables and the various specs?

Christina: Uh,

Brett: you know a shit ton.

Christina: I do, unfortunately, I know a lot.

Brett: So I, I had been operating under the assumption that there were basically, you had like data USBC cables, you had, uh, thunderbolt USBC cables and you had like, power only USPC cables.

It turns out there’s like 18 different varieties of different, uh, like vol, uh, voltage, uh, amperage, uh, levels, like total wattage basically. And, um, and transfer speeds. And, [00:13:00] um, and there’s like maximum links for different types of cable. And it, it, I started to understand why like. One device would charge with one cable and another device would not charge with the same cable, even though they all have the same connector.

Christina: Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I think this is, this is why, um, some of us have been really like eye rolly at the EU for their pronouncements about certain things, because simply mandating a connector type doesn’t actually solve the problem.

Brett: No, it actually confuses it a little bit

Christina: I think Yeah, I was going to say exactly. I think in some cases it makes it worse.

Right? And, and then you have different, like, and, and then getting SB four into it, uh, uh, versus like, like, like, like various Thunderbolt versions. Like that adds complications too, because technically SB four and Thunderbolt four should basically be the same, but they’re not really, there are a couple of things that Thunderbolt might have that [00:14:00] USB four doesn’t necessarily have to have, although for all intents and purposes they might be the same.

And then of course, thunderbolts five is its own thing too. So like I bought off of Kickstarter, I got like this, you know, like a cable charger, basically like, like a connector thing. It was like $120. For this, this, this thing that basically you can plug a cable into and you can see its voltage and um, or not voltage, I guess it’s uh, you know, amperage or whatever.

And you can see like, it, it, it’s transfer speed and you can basically like check that on like a little display, which is useful, but the fact that like, you have to buy that sometimes. So like figure out, well, okay, well which cable is this? Right? And then, uh, to your point about lengths, right? So like, okay, so you want something that’s going to be fast charging but also high speed data transfer.

Alright, well that means that you, the cable’s gonna have to be stiff. It’s not gonna be able to be something that’s really bendable. Um, which of course is what most people are going to want. So like you can get a fast charge, like a 240 wat or a hundred and, you know, 20 wat or, or [00:15:00] whatever, um, like a USB 2.0 transfer speed cable.

But if you want one that’s, uh, going to be, you know, fast charging and. Fast data transfer, then like that’s a different type. And they have like limited lengths, which again, can also be associated with like Thunderbolt or Thunderbolt. You know, cables are much more expensive. Um, and, uh, uh, you know, the, the, the, but their, their lengths are limited.

Um, yeah. Uh, it’s very confusing.

Brett: Did you know that in rare circumstances there are even devices that will only charge with an A to C cable.

Christina: Yes,

Brett: That’s so insane.

Christina: yeah, no, I’ve run into that myself and then that’s a weird thing and I don’t even know how that should work. ’cause it’s, it’s, it’s a bizarre thing. You’re like, okay, well I thought this was just like a, you know, maybe like a dumb end, but it’s like, no, there’s like, you know, basically a microchip

Brett: Like a two pin to two pin.

Christina: at this point.

Brett: Like two pen to two pen, no pd like you would think that would work with C to C, [00:16:00] but somehow it has to be A to c. I am getting one of those cable testers. I asked for one for Christmas so I could figure out this pile of cables I have and like my Sonos Ace headphones are very particular about which cables and what, um, charging hub I hooked them up to

Christina: Right. Oh, yeah, hubs. I was gonna say, hubs introduce a whole other complication into this too, because depending on what hub you’re using, if you’re using a USB hub, it may or may not have certain things versus a Thunderbolt hub versus something else, versus just like, um, you know, a power brick. Like, yeah.

Brett: Yeah. It’s fun stuff you.

Christina: Yeah. No, it’s annoying. And, um, like, and what, what’s frustrating about this is like some of the cables that they’re better, like you can look at the, you know, the bottoms of them and you can see like they will have like the USB like four, or they might have 3.2, or they might have, you know, like the thunderbolt, you know, um, uh, icon [00:17:00] with, with, with its version.

So you can figure out is this 20 gigabits, is this 40, is this 80? Um, but um. That’s not a guaranteed thing, and that also doesn’t guarantee authenticity of stuff, right? So a lot of the cables, you know, you buy off the internet can be, you know, and they might be, or even at stores, right? Like you’re, you’re not buying something from, even if you get things from Belkin or whoever, like, those things can have issues too.

Um, although they at least tend to have better warranties. I bought a Balkan, um. Uh, like a, a, a PD cable, like a two 40 cable that I think it was like, you know, uh, 10 feet longer something. It was supposed to have some sort of long warranty and, and because the, the, you know, um, faster transfer ones, um, are, even though it was braided, you know, it stiff and it, it broke, like there was, uh, the, like the, you know, the connect with the part of the, the, the cable near the, the end, um, did that thing that typically apple cables do, where like, it, it sort of [00:18:00] fraying and you started like seeing the exposed wires and then like, you start to like, feel like, you know, like an electric charge, like

Brett: A little tingle.

Christina: you’re Yeah.

And you’re like, okay, this isn’t good. Um, and so I at least had my Amazon receipt, so I was able to like. Get them to mail me a new one relatively easily. And like Anchor has an okay warranty too. But it’s one of those things you’re like, okay, when did I buy this? I was like, I didn’t even buy this a year ago, and this thing already crapped out.

Um, versus, you know, you can get some really nice braided cables that are flexible, but they’re just gonna be 2.0 speeds. Um, and, and then if you buy, you know, you just buy like some random cable, you know, like at the airport or whatever. You’re like, all right, well, I don’t even know

Brett: Great.

Christina: anything about this. Uh, yeah,

Brett: I have heard good things. I’ve heard good things about the company. Cable Matters.

Christina: Yeah. Yeah. They make good stuff. They make good stuff. But again, at least the cables matters, cables that I have have been primarily stiffer cables because they tend to be like the, the higher transfer [00:19:00] speeds. So, um, like I have a cable, cable matters Thunderbolt cable, and I have like a USB four cable, I think.

Um, but like, these are cables that like. I don’t, I mean, I, I have one that I, I kind of travel with, but I don’t, um, either keeping it as little cable matters, uh, uh, plastic, um. Like, so they come in like these, these case, uh, not these cases. Uh, they come in like these, uh, almost like Ziploc bag type of things.

Um, which is a great way to ship cables honestly, you know, rather than using a box and, and like I, and I might toss one of those in a suitcase or a backpack, um, rather than having like the cable just out there loose. But I do that primarily because again, like they’re stiff and they’re not the sorts of things that I necessarily want, like in the bottom of my bag, you know, potentially getting broken and, and, and, and twisted and all of that.

Um, they are overpriced for what they are and they are definitely not like, they’re not a high transfer cable, but if you can find ’em on sale, the beats, cables, the, the, the, the, the, the branded Beats cables, I actually like them better [00:20:00] than the apple cables that are the same thing, because they are, they’re longer, uh, by, you know, um, a, a few inches than, um, the, the Apple ones.

But they’re still braided and they’re nice. And I was able to get, I dunno, this was a, this was not even Black Friday, but this was. Um, you know, sometime in like early November, I think, um, or maybe it was like late October. It might’ve been a Prime Day thing, I don’t know, but they were like eight or $9 a piece, and so I bought like five or six of them.

Um, and they are, you know, uh, uh, PD and like, like, like fast charging peoples, they might not be 240, but I think they’re, they’re, they were like a hundred and you know, like 20 watts or whatever. But, um, you know, not high transfer speeds, but if you’re wanting to just quickly charge something and have it, you know, be a, a decent length and be like flexible.

Those I don’t, those I don’t hate. Um, anchor makes pretty good cables. You green seems to be the company that’s sponsoring everyone now for various things. [00:21:00] But, um, I don’t know. I’ve started using MagSafe more and more, uh, like wireless charging when I can for some things, at least for phones,

Brett: yeah. I actually have some U green wireless charging solutions that are really good.

Christina: Yeah. Yeah. I just got one of their, uh, their 10,000 million pair battery fast charging battery things because now the MagSafe, uh, can be like up to, you know, 30 watts or whatever, or 25 watts or, or, or, or whatever it is. Like it’s, um, a lot more, um, usable than, you know, when it was like 10 or, or, or even 15.

You’re like, okay, this, this is actually not going to be like the, the slowest, you know, charging thing known to man. But of course, obviously it’s like you can use it with your phone and with your AirPods, but the rest of the things out there don’t, don’t all support shi too, so,

Brett: Right.

Christina: yeah.

Brett: All right. So, um, I want to talk about TV a little bit.

Christina: Yeah. I think before we do that though, we should probably

Brett: oh, we should, we [00:22:00] have two sponsors to fit in Jesus. I should get on that.

Sponsor Break: Shopify

Brett: Um, let’s start with, uh, let’s start with Shopify. This episode is brought to you by Shopify. Have you been dreaming of owning your own business?

In addition to having something to sell, you’ll need a website, a payment system, a logo, a way to advertise to new customers, et cetera, et cetera. It can all be overwhelming and confusing, but that’s where today’s sponsor, Shopify comes in. Shopify is the commerce platform behind millions of businesses around the world, and 10% of all e-commerce in the us From household names like Mattel and Gym Shark to brands.

Just getting started, get started with your own design studio with hundreds of ready to use templates. Shopify helps you build beautiful online store to match your brand style, accelerate your content creation. Shopify is packed with helpful AI tools that write product descriptions, page headlines, and even enhance your product photography.[00:23:00]

Get the word out like you have a marketing team behind you. Easily create email and social media campaigns wherever your customers are scrolling or strolling. And best yet, Shopify is your commerce expert with world-class expertise and everything from managing inventory to international shipping, to processing returns and beyond.

If you’re ready to sell, you’re ready for Shopify. Turn your big business idea into with Shopify on your side. Sign up for your $1 per month trial and start selling today@shopify.com slash Overtired. Go to shopify.com/ Overtired. That is shopify.com/ Overtired. Thanks Shopify.

Christina: Thank you Shopify.

Brett: It’ll be, it’ll be just tight as hell by the time people hear it. But that was rough. I, that, that, that, that read, you just heard I [00:24:00] edited like six places. ’cause I kept, I, I don’t know. I’m tired. I’ve been up since, I’ve been up since two today.

Christina: Yeah. Shit, man. That’s, yeah, you again, like you’ve been having like sleep issues. It’s, it’s,

Brett: Maybe, maybe I shouldn’t be doing sponsor reads.

Christina: No, no, no, no, no. Uh, no. We definitely wanna talk about tv. Do you wanna do, do we wanna do our second, um, uh, uh, ad break

Brett: let’s do a block. Let’s make it a

Christina: Let’s do it. Block. Alright, fantastic.

Sponsor Break: Copilot Money

Christina: Alright, well, since we are about to go into 2026, this is a great time to, uh, think about your finances.

So are you ready to take control of your finances? Well meet copilot money. This is the personal finance app that makes your money feel clear and calm with a beautiful design. Smart automation copilot money brings all of your spending, saving and investment accounts into one place. It’s available on iOS, Mac, iPad, and now on the web, which is really great, uh, because I know, uh, for me anyway, that’s one of my one kind of things [00:25:00] about some of these like tools like this is that there’s not a web app.

I’m really bothered by it. This is, you know, it’s a frustration that like the Apple card, for a long time, you know, you couldn’t really access things on, on the web. Even now it’s still kind of messy, like being able to handle things on the web. But as we enter 2026, it is time for a fresh start. And so with the, uh, mint shutdown and rising financial uncertainty, consumers are seeking clarity and control.

And this is where copilot money comes in. So copilot money can help you track your budgets, your savings goals, and your net worth seamlessly. Plus, with the the new, um, web launch, you can enjoy a sudden experience on any device, which is really good. And guess what? For a limited time, you can get 26% off your first year when you sign up through the web app. New Year’s only don’t miss out on the chance to start the new year with confidence. There are features like automatic subscription tracking, so you’ll never miss upcoming charges again.

Copilot money’s privacy first approach ensures that your data is secure and their team is dedicated to helping you stress less [00:26:00] about money. So whether you’re a finance pro or just starting out, copilot money is there to help you make better decisions.

Visit, try dot copilot money slash Overtired and use the code Overtired to sign up for your one month free trial and embrace financial clarity. That’s try.copilot.money/ Overtired. Use the coupon Overtired. And again, that is 26% off for your first year. So thank you copilot money for, uh, sponsoring this week’s, uh, uh, episode.

Oh, one other note about copilot money. They were, um, an apple, uh, design award finalist. So it’s a really well designed app and, um, we love to see, um, apps like this available on, on the web as well as iOS and, and MAC os.

Brett: I have started using it very much because of the web version, and it is, it is really good.

Christina: yeah, yeah. No, yeah. For, yeah, for me, that is like a, an actual like. Concrete requirement.

Exploring Rocket Money and Web Interfaces

Christina: Any money

Brett: Like I’ve, I’ve [00:27:00] paid, I have about eight months left. I paid for a year of, of Rocket Money or whatever it’s called now. Um, and I’ve always loved that app, but yeah, it does not have a web interface. And once I started trying copilot out, I realized how much I really did want a web interface for that stuff, you know?

What else have you seen?

Discovering Umami Analytics

Brett: Umami the analytics platform.

Christina: Yes.

Brett: It is so good. And it’s, it’s open source and you can self-host. And it is like, I, I’ve been using Fathom Analytics for a long time and I like Fathom, but Umami is, it has like all of the, uh, advanced stuff you would get with Google Analytics, but with like way more privacy focus and you’re not giving information to Google for one.

Um, and the interface is beautiful. I love that. It’s so good.

Christina: Yeah. Um, umami is really good. I think, uh, there’s another one, I’m [00:28:00] trying to think of what it was called. There are a number of these various, um, analytics, uh, hosted things, but no, umami is definitely a really good one.

Nostalgia for Mint and Fever

Christina: And I like, um, it reminds me, um, it was, what was it? It was Mint. It was Mint, Sean Edmond’s Mint.

Which

Brett: I was just gonna ask you if you remembered that.

Christina: yeah, which was, which was one of the, uh, plausible analytics. It’s another one too. Um, which is also like, um, they, they have a hosted version, but you can also self-host. Um, and then that’s also a, a, a, another, uh, good one. But yeah. Um, was like my, my all time favorites, uh, you know, app.

I, I, I loved that.

Brett: Um, what was his RSS one? Uh, fever? Fever.

Christina: was, was the best fever, was the best.

The Decline of RSS and Google Reader

Christina: And it was funny, like I, I think I’ve talked about this before, I was more insulated and like less upset than some people by the, the Google reader death because I had a, a, I’d been using Fever for so long, and then obviously, you know, stuff being updated and doesn’t really work [00:29:00] super well with like, the latest versions of PHP and things like that.

But, you know, a lot of people were really, understandably and, and still more than a decade on, you know, very upset by the death of, um, Google reader. But I think because I, I had paid for and used, you know, my own, um, self-hosted fever installation, and then there were apps that people used for, you know, APIs and whatnot to build, you know, Macs or iOS apps or, or whatever.

Like, I, I was obviously upset about Google Reader being shut down, but I was like, okay, you know, I, I can just, you know, move on to something else. And, um, and I’ve used, uh, feeder, um, not, not, not feeder, um,

Brett: Reader

Christina: is. No, no. Maybe, uh, it’s, uh, not Feed Demon. Um, that was like the OG one. Um, it’ll come to me, um, because I, I, yes.

Thank you. Feed Ben. Thank you, thank you. One of the ones that’s still around, uh, from like the, of the, you know, various Google reader alternatives, like many of them. You know, closed up shop.[00:30:00]

Brett: Yeah.

Christina: if they kind of realized, you know, by Google reader, like this is the, unfortunately a niche market. Um, now that didn’t help the fact that like, you know, when people, when web browsers Safari, I think started at first and then Firefox did, and then, you know, uh, Chrome was, was fairly early too.

Like when all the web browsers took away like RSS buttons to make it easy to subscribe to feeds or to auto discover feeds, and you had to like install like a, an extension or whatever to do that. Like, that all helped with the, the demise of RSS in a lot of ways. And of course, people moving everything into closed platforms and, and social networks and stuff that, you

Brett: In, in the tech world though. So I have, my blog gets about 20,000 visits a week, but it gets 30,000 RSS downloads, like, uh, like daily, 30,000 readers are, are, are pulling my site. Um, so RSS is far from dead in the tech world.

Christina: Right. Well, [00:31:00] well, I think, I think in a certain demographic, right? I think if you were to ask like a new, like college grads, I don’t think that any of them are using RSS at least not actively, right? Like, I mean, you might have a few, but like it’s, it’s just not gonna be like a thing where they’re gonna be, act like they might be using some apps that do similar types of things and might even pull in feed sources maybe.

But it, it’s, it’s just not like a, like when, when I was graduating from college or in college, like everybody had, you know, RSS clients and that was just kind of a, a known thing.

Brett: Yeah. So speaking of traffic, um, I don’t, did I mention that I got delisted on Bing and

Christina: You did,

Brett: I am, I’m back

Christina: figure that out? You’re back now. Okay.

Brett: I’m back now.

Switching to Kagi Search Engine

Brett: And, um, I have switched to using Kaji, um, as my primary search engine and they replicate all of duck duck go’s bang searches.

Christina: Yes.

Brett: So I

Christina: one of the things I love about them. [00:32:00] Yes.

Brett: I was pleased to see there’s a Bang Turp search on Kaji.

Um, I actually use

Christina: or is it kgi? Because I think I’ve always called it kgi. Yeah, it’s KA, it’s K, it’s KAGI. For anybody who’s who’s, uh, I don’t know how to, how, how, if it’s kgi, kgi, um, uh, you know, Kaji, whatever,

Brett: It’ll be in the show notes. What the fuck ever, we’ll just call it KGI. Um, and yeah, so like I was super happy ’cause I used the Bang Turp to search my own site. I just got used to doing that.

The Rise of AI-Generated Content

Brett: Um, and, but it is like you can, the reason I switched to said web, uh, search engine is um, because you can report sites that are just AI slop and they will verify those reports and remove or flag slop sites in your search results.

’cause I was getting sick, even with DuckDuckGo, like five out [00:33:00] of 10 results were always, I’d get in, I’d get there, I’d get one, maybe two paragraphs into, uh, an article and realize, oh, someone just typed in my search term into chat GPT and then

Christina: Oh yeah.

Brett: automated it.

Christina: Oh, I was gonna say there, there it is. Automated at this point. And, and like, to be clear, like a lot of search results, even before like the rise of like genre of AI were a variant of this, where you would see like people like buying older domain names that expired. Well, yeah, but even before that happened mean that, that obviously when, when, when the Christina Warren and Brett Terpstra and then they, they changed your name.

Um, I

Brett: know, like Jason Turra or

Christina: Or something like that. Yeah, it was, it was, it was, it was weird. Um, I mean, you know, um, does that site, did, did have they given up the ghost on that? I’m curious. Um, yeah. Wow. Okay. They are still, well, no, they haven’t published anything since November 30th. So something has happened where they, uh, are [00:34:00] they, they’re definitely cutting down on, on various things.

Um, oh no. Paul Terpstra. Oh my God. Paul Terpstra. You are still,

Brett: Yeah.

Christina: you were like the one author there that I see on this website. Um, now what was, what was messed up about, about this? Um, although no. Okay. Their homepage, the last one they say is like, OCT is like, uh, November, um, uh, 30th. But if you click on the, the Paul trips to handle, then like you see, um, December 22nd, uh, which is, which is today as we’re recording this,

Brett: Wow, I didn’t even realize.

Christina: Yeah. So, alright. So that is still, somehow that grift is still going on. But yeah, I mean, even before the rise of those things, you would see, you know, sites that would either buy up dead domains and then like, have like very similar looking content, but slightly different maybe, you know, like, uh, you know, injected with a bunch of, you know. Links or whatever, or you would see people who would, you know, do very clearly SEO written and, and probably, you know, [00:35:00] like, again, pre generative ai, but, you know, assisted slop content. But yeah, now it’s, it’s just, it’s crazy. Like, and it doesn’t help that, like the AI summaries, which can be useful, but, um, and they’re getting better, which is good only because they’re so prominent.

Like, I’m not a fan of them. But if you’re not using an alternative search engine, like, you know, you see these AI summaries and like if they’re bad and sometimes they are then.

Brett: Often

Christina: You know, well, they’re, they’ve gotten better, uh, is the only thing I would say. I, I still wouldn’t rely on them, but I’ve, I’ve noticed a, like, I’ve noticed a, a genuine, like uptick in like, improvements and in like, how awful they are probably in like the last six weeks, which is damning with faint praise.

I’m not at all saying it’s good. I am simply saying, it’s like, I’m primarily thinking for like, people who are like, like less tech savvy relatives who are going to just go to, you know, bing.com or, or google.com and then see those sorts of things. Right. Um, and, uh, you know, we’re not gonna be able to convince them to go to a, a, a third [00:36:00] party search engine.

Um, although, you know, some people, like, I think my mom was using Duck to Go for a while as like her default on her iPhone, um, which I was, I was like proud of her about, but I was also kind of like, uh, that’s got its own issues. But no, I, I like ka a lot. Um, I, I’ve

Brett: Well, and it’s so keyboard driven, like DuckDuckGo has good keyboard shortcuts. KAGY slash Kaji has even better keyboard shortcuts. Like you can navigate and control everything with, uh, like Gmail style, single key keyboard shortcuts, which I really like.

Christina: Yeah. Yeah, I like that too. And then they, they, of course, they make like a, a web kit, um, like a browser, um, that, that has, they’ve back ported, um, you know, a lot of chrome extensions too. I personally don’t see the point in that. Um, I, I think that if you’re going to be like that committed to, like, using like the, you know, the web extension format and like using like more popular extensions, you might as well [00:37:00] just use a Chrome fork if you don’t wanna use Chrome, which is fine, but like, you could use a browser like Helium, which, which we talked about last show, which has, um, the, the, the hash bangs kind of integrated in, or you could use, you know, if you wanted to use, um, um, you know, the, the, the, the

Brett: o is Orion, is Orion the one you’re talking about that? Yeah.

Christina: that, that, yeah, that, that, that, that, that, that’s Katy’s thing. And that was actually originally how I heard about them was because it was like, oh, this is interesting. Um, you know, this is a kind of an interesting, you know, kind of alternative browser. And then it turned out that that was just kind of a, in some ways, kind of a front to promote the, the search engine, which is the real, you know, thing.

Um, which is fine, right? I mean, that, that was Google’s model. Um,

Brett: Well, and we should mention for anyone who hasn’t tried it, it is a paid service. Um, and you are getting search results with no ads and, and spam, uh, ai, slot protection and all of the benefits you would expect from a paid service. So [00:38:00] I think, like for me, five bucks a month gets me, I think 300 searches, which is.

Plenty for me, like, I guess I, I’m still waiting to see, I’ve never counted how many searches I do a month,

Christina: Yeah,

Brett: you know, like three searches a day, uh, would come out to like 90 searches a month and I have 300 available, so I think I’ll be fine.

Christina: yeah, yeah. I mean, yeah, basically being able to get to do 10 a day, which in most cases is fine. What I’ve done is I’m on, like, they have a, a, a family plan, um, and they don’t care. They even, I think in their documentation, or at least they did, they do not care if you are like actually in a family with the people that you are on or not.

So if you, you know, find some folks that you wanna kind of sync up with, you can like, you know, be on a family plan together and you can save money, um, on, uh, whatever their, uh, um, their pricing [00:39:00] stuff is. So, um, so me, me and Justin Williams are, uh, in a, uh,

Brett: Justin Williams, I haven’t heard that name in forever.

Christina: Yeah. Yeah. We went to C Oasis together.

We went both nights in Los Angeles, um, in August. Yeah. Um, or September rather. Um, yeah, so, okay, so this is how this works. They have, their starter plan is, is $5 a month, which includes, and they do have an AI assistant too. So it was funny, they had the AI slot protection, but they also have like an AI assistant that you can use and like an AI summarizer and whatnot.

Um, that’s $5 a month. And then there’s the professional plan, which is, so that’s for 300 searches a month for the standard AI for starter $5 a month. The professional plan is unlimited searches and standard ai, that’s $10 a month. And then the ultimate is, um. Uh, everything in professional plus you get like premium model access, which, okay, but the family plan, um, is, is the, so you can do one of two things.

You have a duo [00:40:00] plan, which is two professional accounts for a couple, which is $14 a month plus sales tax. So it’s, uh, you know, average of $7 per person, which I think is what Justin and I are on. And then there’s a family plan with up to six family members. And again, they don’t care if you are actually in a family or not, and that’s $20 a month.

So the real thing to do if you’re wanting to like, you know, save on this is like find five friends,

Brett: Yeah.

Christina: get on the $20 a month, you know, family plan thing. Spread the, spread the cost, and that way you can get the, you know, professional plan for, for, for less. But to your

Brett: All right.

Christina: most people, it’s probably $300, 300 searches a month is probably plenty.

And if you search a lot like we do, I, I think it is worth paying for.

Brett: yeah, yeah. All right.

TV Shows: Is TV Just Okay Now?

Christina: anyway, but we wanted to talk about tv, so let’s

Brett: Well do, we’re, we’re at 50 minutes already, so I think we need to choose whether we do TV or gratitude. What

Christina: do you have a [00:41:00] gude, like a good one?

Brett: I, I, no, I have a, I have a throwaway one.

Christina: Okay.

Brett: I, it was one of those, like, I looked at my doc and I was like, oh, I don’t think I’ve talked about that even though I probably have, um, yeah, let’s just talk about tv.

So I, I have been noting, and my question in the show notes was, is TV just okay now? Because I’ve been watching, I watched Stranger Things, pluribus Down, cemetery Road, platonic, and all of it was, it was entertaining, but it wasn’t like, must watch tv. None of it was like, none of it was as good as like Modern Family.

Modern Family was fucking good. Tv, like family friendly and just like I’ve, I’ve been through that series so many times and it’s always fun and it’s always better than like pluribus. I like the, I like the concept kind of, it’s not. not all that, um, engaging, I guess.[00:42:00]

Christina: I like it. But,

Brett: Yeah. I don’t hate it like I do, I do like it, but it’s not like, I don’t, I don’t count the days until the next episode comes out and I miss, I miss things being really good.

So you had a couple responses to that though.

Christina: Well, I mean, I tend to agree with you. So first of all, there, I put in the, in the show notes, um, there’s a link to a thing that, uh, that James and Pozak wrote for the, the New York Times, uh, God a year and a half ago now called, um, the Comfortable Problem of Mid tv. And he said it, it, it’s got a great cast, it looks cinematic, it’s, um, fine and is everywhere.

And kind of talking about like, you know, we went from like the era of like peak TV to now being, um. You know what, what he’s dubbed like mid tv and I think that there’s, there’s some truth to that. Um, and, and, and he even says at the beginning, let me say up front, this is not an essay about how bad TV is today, just the opposite.

There’s, um, little truly bad high profile television made anymore, um, is it’s more talking about, um, like [00:43:00] what we have instead Today is something less awful, but in a way more sad, the willingness to retreat, to settle to trade, the ambitious for the defendable. And I think that there’s some truth to that.

Um, I think that we see this movies now too, and with movies it’s actually much more of a problem. Like there’s some really high highs. Um, but because the movie industry is in such a bad place, um, it, it’s that much more notable when like, you don’t have like a big strong slate of, of things. And so, you know, it, it, it’s more of a problem.

TV for, for better or worse, has become the dominant entertainment form. And yeah, I think that it, it, it’s fine. Uh, but there are very few things that I’m like, oh, wow, yeah, that, that’s like, you know, the wire. Um, not that anything is, but you know what I mean? But is, but even like, you know, pluribus, which I really like.

I actually think that’s, um, my, my favorite show of, of, um, 2025, um, at least new show. Um, well, maybe the studio. The studio. I might have, I, I, I might put,

Brett: That was pretty

Christina: above that. But, but, but, but [00:44:00] like, it’s one of those things where I’m like, okay, you know, um, it’s not breaking bad, right? Like, if we’re gonna be comparing Vince Gilligan shows, and maybe that’s unfair, but, you know, it just, but, but still, like, you know, you’re gonna be compared to your last hit.

And, and, and, and that is what it is. Um, I will say though, like, I haven’t watched Stranger Things in years, and I don’t, I don’t, I don’t think I can force myself to like, care about that again, but I’ve heard kind of mixed

Brett: That’s where L is too, L doesn’t care. And, and then there’s the whole like two cast members being Zionists kind of turned a whole bunch of people off and

Christina: Well, and well, David Harbor, David Harbor’s whole Lily Allen thing. Are you, are you, are you familiar with this floor at all?

Brett: No.

Christina: Okay. You know who Lily Allen is?

Brett: Yes.

Christina: Okay. So she and David Harbor were married and, um, she wrote an album called, uh, uh, west End Girl that, that came out, uh, like in November, which is actually a really good album, [00:45:00] which is like White Girl Lemonade, where she just basically reads him to filth for being an absolute piece of shit.

Like, apparently like, you know, they were together, they were married or whatever. She goes off to London to perform in a play and he’s like. Oh, we’re gonna be away for months. I, I wanna sleep with other people. And so they kind of like, she kind of accepts getting into an open relationship with him, even though she didn’t really want to be, which look that her, that’s her bad, whatever.

But then he proceeds to like, do things that was not what they’d agreed upon on, upon the parameters of their, of their relationship. And then she’s just like brutally honest about the entire thing. And so as you’re listening to this album, you’re just learning more and more about like, David Harbor’s like sex life and, um, and stuff.

And, and like, it’s just on blast. It’s incredible. Um, but, uh, yeah, so there’s, there’s some of that stuff. There’s, I, I don’t know, like I don’t, I don’t really follow the rest of the cast stuff except that, uh, the girl who plays, um, 11 like. Frequently want to smack because just the most annoying [00:46:00] celebrity in on the planet.

But like, putting that aside, um, I just, I stopped caring. It took them too long between seasons and the, and, and, and the budget for that show was also so insane. I’m like, you, you cost more than strain than thinking of Thrones. Game of Thrones is, was even at its worst, was a better show than Stranger Things.

So like it, yeah. But but that goes to your point. Like, it’s like, it’s okay.

Brett: Yeah. Yeah,

Christina: Um, I will say the new season of Fallout just, um, premiered and so far I I’m still really enjoying that. Um,

Brett: yet to see it.

Christina: you should, you should definitely watch the

Brett: What is it on?

Christina: uh, Amazon

Brett: Okay.

Christina: and, uh, and it’s, and it’s really, really good. Um. And this year they are doing the episodic, um, not episodic, the weekly drop, right.

Rather than the binge thing. So the first season, uh, they dropped it all at once and um, and I was a little bit worried. I was like, fuck, does that mean they don’t [00:47:00] believe in this? What are they going to do? Wound up being like Amazon’s biggest hit after their Lord of the Rings, um, you know, thing. And so it was immediately kind of picked up for a second season and it was picked up for a third season before the second season even, uh, premiered.

Um, and uh, and that might be the final one. Um, they’re saying, but, but, but, but who knows? But, but so far anyway, like they’ve only, there’s only been one episode, but it’s, it’s been good so far.

The Cultural Phenomenon of Heated Rivalry

Christina: Um, but, but what I was gonna talk to you about is the gay hockey show.

Brett: Which is.

Christina: It’s called Heated rivalry. It’s on HBO Max.

It was originally just supposed to be on, uh, a Canadian streamer called Crave. And um, then at the, like, the, the like 11th hour, HBO Max picked it up and was like, okay, we’ll play this in, um, some of our territories and other things. And I wanna be very clear, this is not high art at all. This is like, no way.

Like this actually in some ways it, it personifies [00:48:00] the TV is just okay now thing, but in other ways it’s actually a little bit more interesting just because the cultural phenomenon that has happened around it in like the last, like, like it hasn’t even been out a month and it’s only six episodes, although they are also going to be getting a second season.

Um, it’s sort of wild how, like I went from, I’d seen a trailer for it and I was like, okay, whatever. And like it came out, I think like right after Thanksgiving. Then like within like two or three weeks, like literally I wasn’t following anything around it, but my Instagram, my TikTok, Twitter, everything that I was seeing was just all about the discourse around the show.

And it’s like a bunch of us all seem to have to have discovered it. Like one weekend where we were like, okay, we’re gonna actually sit down and watch the gay hockey show. Um, and this is exactly what it is. It is a gay hockey show. So it is based on, there was a series of books that this, uh, female, uh, writer Rachel Reed wrote, um, uh, about like, uh, I think like they were like eBooks, types of thing.

Um, uh, I think although there, there is now I [00:49:00] think like a, a hard cover release because they’ve been so popular and they’re just, it’s just ero, it’s just smut, right? It’s basically fanfic dressed up in something else. And the idea was like, okay, you have like these, you know, male like hockey players who are closeted and kind of have like this, this romance that, that starts from like 2008, um, through like, I dunno, like, like 2017 or 2018.

And there are a number of different. Books or stories in the universe. But the one that people liked the most was the, the second book, which is called Heed Rivalry. You don’t really need to know any about that. The big thing about the show is that it is essentially like soft core gay porn. Um, but yet it’s like weirdly compelling in a way.

Like, it, it is very, like, there’s, there’s some sweet aspects to it. Like you were before the, the show, you were saying, oh, it’s kinda like Heart Stopper could not be further from Heart Stopper. ’cause Heart Stopper is very sweet and twee and kind of like loving and like whatnot. This is like. You know, like guys in their twenties with amazing asses, [00:50:00] you know, like doing things to one another kind of an in secret.

And, and the, the thing is, there’s not a whole lot of plot. Like the plot is the porn. Because, because the whole thing is, is that like they don’t spend, they don’t have a time to spend a lot of time together because they’re, they’re closeted and their rivals. Oh, that’s the whole conceit. It’s like they’re these two great hockey players and they, they, they, um, you know, um, play for opposing teams and they’re like, each other’s biggest rivals, but like, they’re, they’re fucking, um, and uh, it, it’s, uh, again, it’s not high art at all, but

Brett: the target audience for this?

Christina: And here’s the interesting thing. So the books are almost entirely read by women, um, and which, which makes sense. There’s, there’s a lot of like, you know, like, male, male, like, um, like the history of slash fiction goes back to like, like Fanfic in general, like goes back to like women writing, like Spock and, and, uh, um, what’s the space together?

Kirk Together. Yeah. Um, and so the books are almost entirely, uh, consumed by, by women and probably straight women, although probably some queer women too. Um, but the [00:51:00] show seems to be a mix of gay men, straight women, all, although I’ve seen a lot of lesbians. As well. Um, yeah, yeah, because again, like the discourse is just kind of ridiculous and, and the memes are fun.

Um, the guy who created it, he’s gay or created the, the, the television adaptation. He’s gay and, uh, I think he’s done a, a, a pretty good job with it. The, the leads are the thing that’s like incredible, like the, especially the guy who plays the, the Russian character, Ilya, uh, that actor is really, really good and he’s Texan, and yet he does like a great Russian accent and, um.

And, and he’s very attractive. And like I, I, I can see like why a lot of people are into it, but it’s funny ’cause like New York Magazine, like they weren’t even covering the show, which, why would you, it was like some Canadian kind of, you know, you know, thing that barely gets picked by HBO. Then it takes off and now like they’re covering it.

The, the last time I remember New York Magazine covering a show like this, like Vociferously was Gossip Girl, like 18 years ago. Um, [00:52:00] and it kind of reminds me of that, where like everybody woke up one day when they’re like, oh, this is like a cultural moment now. So again, not good television, probably not gonna necessarily be for everyone, but, but it’s a moment.

And like, I kept seeing edits, I kept seeing Mo, I kept seeing edits on TikTok and stuff and I was like, okay, do I have to watch the gay hockey show? All right, I have to watch the gay hockey show so that it’s, we might be at the point where like TV is just okay, but at least there are some good like moments about, whereas the culture, we can all like agree.

Okay, we’re all gonna be talking about this one thing.

Brett: That sounds like what I’ll be doing on Christmas Day.

Christina: Oh my God. Actually that would be a great thing to watch on Christmas. And I think that the final episode is gonna come out like the day after Christmas, so there you go.

Brett: Done Deal. Cool.

Wrapping Up and Holiday Wishes

Brett: All right, well thanks for, we’re recording this the same morning. The show’s supposed to come out, so I gotta do some editing, but uh, but [00:53:00] thanks for showing up while you’re in Atlanta and yeah, this has been a classic, a fun classic Overtired.

Christina: absolutely. Well, um, get some sleep, uh, take care of yourself. Um, happy holidays. Um, uh, hope that a, a Christmas isn’t too weird for you. And, um, and happy New Year.

Brett: you too. Get some sleep.