Are You Trying to Find a Policy to Campaign For?

Lis: Let's try to have policy institutions that work for people right now. I suggest we maybe move on from this specific bill, and ask you about some broader lessons or kind of insight or run policy. You were involved in setting up am a p p g. And i'm sure you maybe just have like some kind of insight er on how to do policy,. irrespective of what said policy is. E, so tryg to find like, a policy to campaign for is often about finding that thing where it's un political genders enough. Sometimes you don't want to go to the politicians at all, and you might just want to talk to the civil servants who are doing tha of