Sneaky copulation strategy in animals and humans

Malcolm and Simone Collins dive deep into a provocative new hypothesis: Could some trans urges in humans be driven by the same evolutionary mechanism seen in other species — the “sneaky copulator” strategy? Low-status males in certain animals change their physiology to mimic females in order to infiltrate harems and reproduce covertly. Could a similar adaptive response explain elevated rates of extreme brutality, sadism, and aggression observed in trans respondents compared to cis counterparts (drawing from Aella’s massive dataset and historical sexology research)?

We explore:

* Why trans individuals show significantly higher interest in violent and brutal sexual categories

* Historical links between cross-dressing/transvestism and sadomasochism in early psychology

* How modern cultural signals of disempowerment might trigger these ancient fallback strategies

* Connections to mass shooters, sexual violence patterns, and more

This is a controversial, evidence-based exploration of human sexual adaptation — not hate, but an attempt to understand complex phenomena through evolutionary biology.

Episode Transcript:Malcolm Collins: [00:00:00] Anyway, so, the point that I’m making here is he might have actually been, ironically, right, the phenomenon that drives trans urges.

In humans might be the exact same phenomenon that drives trans physiological differences in other species. Wow.

Would you like to know more?

Malcolm Collins: Hello Simone. I’m excited to be here with you today. We have done a video in the past where we document with extensive notes how extremely overrepresented trans people are among mass shooters. And at the video we joke, you know, when somebody says I’m trans, they might as well be.

Speaker 7: Nice to meet you, . Listen, if you ever need anybody murdered. Please give me a call and you, you’re giving him card. No.

Code of ethics. I will kill anyone anywhere. Children, animals, old people, doesn’t matter. I just love killing

Speaker 6: you.

Malcolm Collins: And in that video we go over some hypotheses on what could be causing this, but I have since dug into more research on this particular [00:01:00] topic, and I’m going to expand my hypotheses on this. In a way that expands an entirely new section of my hypothesis on human sexual behavior.

So specifically if you look at because ALA is the best source of data on this. If you look at like really, if you’re looking at any sort of data on sexuality. You either have to look at data sets that came from before the eighties because after that, you know, the, the gender police took over all of the gender science departments and they weren’t able to publish anything that made any of their preferred peoples potentially look questionable.

So you’re either looking at those data sets or alas which is why, just so people know her dataset is enormous.

Simone Collins: Yeah. Her sample sizes are. Extremely enviable. It’s, it’s

Malcolm Collins: around half a million responses, by the way. And people are like, oh, they’re, no. I think now I was just

Simone Collins: reading one of her pe it was in the 800 thousands now.

Malcolm Collins: Wow. Yeah. And, and people will say, oh, her data sets are highly biased. And I’m like, actually they’re not highly biased because she’s [00:02:00] normalizes them all the time. And she finds that they match mainstream statistics. And the vast

Simone Collins: majority of respondents are not her followers. Her survey has gone viral.

Several times on multiple different platforms. Plus it is really good SEO So again, that’s not it either.

Malcolm Collins: Sorry, I’m writing something I wanna ask her to add to the survey. Of same sex attracted people in heterosexual marriages because I love seeing their happiness and satisfaction rankings.

Simone Collins: That would be fascinating. Yes, I heard

Malcolm Collins: there was a study on this, but I haven’t been able to find it, so if I can get it from her dataset, that’d be awesome. But anyway, going to her dataset.

If we are looking at the brutality category which is defined as arousal from extreme violence in porn sex, EG Gores, if you’re beating, et cetera rated zero, not arousing to five very arousing.

If you look at cis min. The rating that you get for this is 0.23. If you look at trans men, it’s 0.83. Okay? [00:03:00] That’s different. Look at, if you look at cis women, it’s 0.21. If you look at trans women, it’s 0.58. So like off the charts higher in both cases, well over two times higher. And in I think

Simone Collins: really very small portions of

Malcolm Collins: each, around four x higher for men.

Simone Collins: Yeah.

Malcolm Collins: So what the heck’s going on here? Right? And then if you look at the percentage with at least. Some interest in that sort of stuff. For cis men, it’s 6%. For trans men, it’s 22%. For cis women, it’s 6%. For trans women, it’s 15%. Okay.

Simone Collins: Wow. Okay.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. So, just some more notes on a-list study here before we go further on this.

‘cause I always find that fun. The rare cases were violent preference flips slightly male leaning overall, but trans respondents, especially trans men, pull it [00:04:00] way higher than cis baselines. Trans people in general score elevated on this for broader violent slash aggressive categories. EG.

Choking, slapping pain, humiliation, degradation, sadism, consensual non-consent. CSNC. Her data consistently shows women, cis plus trans women prefer this significantly over men, generally speaking. And trans respondents are elevated versus they’re cis counterparts in nearly all kink categories, but especially the aggressive ones.

Mm-hmm. With trans men frequently on the top of sadism and brutality and dominance sections. Mm. Categories like. Forced orgasms, choking, slapping, and pain are all female led with cis women being bigger than cis men. Now this is just the other thing that we are always mentioning on the show.

I really hate this myth that women are into weird, kinky stuff because men have twisted them in some way. That does not appear to be the case. No. I’m gonna go over quickly for those who don’t know my. The [00:05:00] rater versus caregiver arousal spectrum in males.

Oh.

So this is important to understand before we go further, because I’m going to be updating it. So what I pointed out is that historically men within monogamous societies, and we actually believe men and women have well, especially women, have a dynamic sexuality that flips when they believe they’re in a religionist society.

And they begin to desire different things from their partners. When they feel that like, and their biology is evolved to adapt to this, but men also have an evolved and adapted biology and there are different optimums that a man might be in. So for example, the way a woman would act if she happened to be born into a society that was ous is going to be very different from a genetic standpoint and optimal genetic standpoint that if she happens to be born in a society that is monogamous, right?

Yeah.

Yeah.

And this is why we argue that the more men a woman sleep with, the less oxytocin she gets from sex, meaning the less she is likely to sort of be forced to fall in [00:06:00] love with whoever she is sleeping with, because that becomes less beneficial as she, the more, the more ous, the more she’s being passed around.

And she, it’s not a good thing. You don’t want that happening. It’s going to lead to bad choices in, in regards to your reproductive success. But I also point out that men historically had two key environments especially successful men, in which the a preferable arousal pattern would’ve been entirely different.

Environment number one is, mm-hmm. They are in a monogamous relationship. So we’re, we’re talking about monogamous here. Obviously men don’t need that much adaption between monogamy and polygeny. By that what I mean is, a, a man generally will like his wife want to dedicate himself to her want to keep her safe even if he has multiple wives.

Yeah, he still benefits those wives are like his property basically, of keeping them safe and treating them gently. But then there’s a separate environment that was also [00:07:00] historically very important to male genetic fitness, which was when you are a rating, when you are a viking, when you are out on the battlefield or conquering a region.

In these scenarios you would want to adapt a very, very different sexual profile. And these are women who you see as disposable in your mind as a male. And we argue that actually a lot of current sort of male weirdness around sexuality or male sexual perversion comes from men beginning to define themselves by their sexuality at an age before they have a monogamous partner.

If they engage with their sexuality through pornography or erotic literature. And, all of these women in their brain are gonna be categorized as disposable. These women, their brain is going to categorize the same way. It would categorize a woman from a town that they had just conquered and were [00:08:00] Yeah, if they were raiding,

Simone Collins: yeah, if they were just a traveling raider or soldier.

Malcolm Collins: And so their brain is going to relate to these, or if they’re just sleeping around a ton in school, like suppose they’re like Chatty Von Ton or whatever, alpha on whatever app, right. You know, getting the 80% of women, right. Yeah. They’re, they’re, they’re, they’re. A arousal system, they’re going to react as if they just conquered a village.

Right. And so this is why women, when they’re matching these top 2% of guys and, and sometimes men, when they are defining their sexuality in regards to the categories of porn that they’re into, think that what they are into is a much more. Brutalist or violent form of sexuality than what they’re actually into.

Because they, they would not feel that way if they were in a monogamous relationship.

Simone Collins: Well, but no, but I mean, they are actually into it. It just happens to be that the environmental cues that are surrounding them are prompting them to be aroused. More

Malcolm Collins: violent

Simone Collins: things. Yeah.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. Yes, yes, yes.

Absolutely. And this, and I think that women can make the same mistake. Women can think, oh, I’m into this, or I’m into this. And it’s [00:09:00] really that, no, you’re only into this because your body thinks that you. Sex slave. That’s, that’s why you think you like these things. It is not that you would like these things if you had four kids and were married to a guy.

Right. You know, and, and you actually see this with, in like BDSM and stuff like this. I, it is, it is fairly rare from what I’ve seen, of people who are into BDSM to continue to be into BDSM after kid three. Mm-hmm. That is really more of a, a, a single lifestyle thing that that is, that is kept up because they incorporated into their identity and then they’re with someone for a while.

And then it’s like, are we really still into this? Like, you know, like I, I, but anyway, where does this, where, where, where do trans people come in? Where, where does the, the trans stuff come in? The trans stuff comes in because I think that I hadn’t considered. The very historically low, sexually valued males would need to take on an entirely alternate sexual strategy.

Now [00:10:00] before we go into what this alternate sexual strategy is, let’s go into a number of research papers that came out in the early days. Because I wanna point out that it’s not just ALA’s data that is showing this or the recent data on. Mass shooters, and if people are like, oh, mass shooters aren’t overwhelmingly trans, we point out, I think it’s, in the last five years, there have been more trans mass shootings and there have been female, like cis female mass shootings since the 1980s.

It’s like bad. So anyway. If we’re, if we’re talking about female shooters, ‘cause if you were looking at a graph of shooters, it looks like there’s been an explosion in female shooters. Yeah.

Okay. Richard von Coft Ebbing this one was with additions up to 1903, compiled hundreds of forensic and chemical cases of transvestism, as he called it. Alongside sadism, masochism and violent and aggressive paraphilias showing their correlation. Magnus Hetfield this funny, he’s the one who but included case studies [00:11:00] where he, again, correlated cross-dressing with treats like sadomasochism.

Havelock Ellis studies the psychology of sex volume seven. Use sexo aesthetic inversion or eism for transvestism describing cases with istic cross-dressing, combined with sadism masochism or violent sexual seams. Mm-hmm. So no, these things used to be thought of as a joint sexual framework by the early people who were studying sexuality.

Cross-dressing or which by the way is not the same as gender dysphoria necessarily. We argue that cross-dressing is like a different thing than the gender dysphoria, but they’re, they’re correlated and they likely would’ve been heavily correlated during this period anyway. That it was, it was understand as a bundled thing with sadomasochistic tendencies.

William Steckel various works psychoanalytic cases. Frequently linking Transvestism fetishistic cross-dressing to sadomasochism and aggressive impulses was examples of violent fantasies tied to clothing. [00:12:00] And then early DSM classifications. This is the DSM 1, 19 52 to 1968 that elicit transvestism directly under sexual deviations, alongside sexual sadism.

And then if you look at more recent stuff Gosling and Wilson. This was in 1980, survey of club members and correspondence, found high rates of sadomasochistic interests, bondage, ripping, pain among transvestites and fetishists. I note, I’m not saying transvestites here as an insult, I’m saying it because it, this was the word they used back in those days.

Yeah. Newspapers boric and, and I also, it’s important to use the word transvestite because transvestite does not mean the same thing as trans does today. Totally. They, they literally have different definitions and, and so you need to use a different word. That, that’s why it would actually be kind of insulting for me to say that they meant trans in this historic company.

It doesn’t matter. Sure. Or like in Burma study, 222 males recruited from clubs reported high rates [00:13:00] of bondage and fantasies while cross-dressed as many incorporating sadomasochistic elements. Then we have perky, etal. I’m not gonna read all of them because you get the idea. Analyze 25 serial sexual murderers and found transvestism present in a substantial minority of them, alongside high rates of fetishism and sadism.

And wow, this isn’t just like. If you’re familiar with the way the trans community talks about like say turfs or something like that. Yeah. It’s very clear that this is still really common in the community.

Don’t blow up our spot, bro. All t slurs are like that. You can trust me around your kid. It’d be transphobic not to. Me with daycare tots. Me when transphobic little girls ask me what I’m doing in the women’s restroom when I’m obviously a woman. the two fantasized about assaulting J. K. Rowling’s grandchildren. Not letting teaslers get with your kids is transphobic. Someone should Harry Potter woman’s grandkids. Orion then goes on to call them turf meats.

Malcolm Collins: I mean, fantasizing about griping somebody, [00:14:00] fantasizing about beating somebody, fantasizing about, I mean even, even the Anna story that we covered, you know, the life of the ide? Oh

yeah, yeah.

You know, where a lot of her stuff was was, you know, violent sexuality related stuff. Okay. So the question is. What’s leading to all of this, and my new theory is to sort of categorize a new category of male that you would have in a historic context is men who are at the bottom of social totem poles.

Mm-hmm. Or who are not attractive enough or don’t have enough social status or don’t have enough whatever, to secure a mate, they would need to adopt a highly deviated sexual profile and arousal profile if they hope to have any chance of reproducing. And there are a few, and this is why I think you get the brutalism.

Combined with the transness, like the wanting to appear as a womanness. Mm-hmm. [00:15:00] One of the things that you find in a lot of species in nature is something called this, this sneaky effer strategy is literally what it’s called. Or

Simone Collins: a sneaky copulation.

Malcolm Collins: Sneaky copulation. Yes. Which is when a, and I love it how.

Trans people. There was recently a case where they like flew the trans flag from like a national park, and he’s like, this proves that trans, it’s natural. It exists across species. Wow. And I’m like. Well, a lot of the times, one, because it like that doesn’t mean photosynthesis is natural in humans. Right.

But I, the funny thing is, is he might have been correct.

Simone Collins: I mean, yeah, I guess live crabs do it.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. Humans, yeah. Claws on man color on men are natural because crabs do it. Crab people.

Speaker: The crab people shall finally reign. Supreme crab people, crab people

Malcolm Collins: anyway, so, the point that I’m making here is he might have actually been, ironically, right, the phenomenon that [00:16:00] drives trans urges.

In humans might be the exact same phenomenon that drives trans physiological differences in other species. Wow. Specifically in many species where like, and you see this in some crab species, I’ll use it crabs as an example here.

Simone Collins: That’s why I said crabs.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. Normal males are very large and they sort of maintain a harem of females that they impregnate, and so they, they keep the, the female safe and they, they have the harem.

But if a male is developing and it is clear that it’s not getting the resources it needs to win in this large male game, it changes its physiology, its pheromones, everything. To appear as if it’s a female. And then what it will do is it will go into the female spaces, EG, the the, the all female communities that these larger males are protecting and attempt [00:17:00] to will essentially grape them.

Simone Collins: It will have unexpected surprise. Surprise sex. Yes. Yeah. On, on. Yeah. We tend to be a harem member, female, and then have sex with other females in

Malcolm Collins: the harem. Yeah. Right. So the, the two strategies that you have, if you’re at the bottom of the totem pole. Is one sneaky effort, strategy, trying to, to get into a man’s you know, you know, and, and human men likely used to have these, there were periods in human history, long periods where for every one man who had children, 17 women had children.

That meant that on average a man had 17 wives. Right. Like these, these are very this is something that happened historically. Right? Yeah. Okay. So, so that’s one strategy. The other strategy is you force yourself on a woman who is, wants to be with another guy or wouldn’t want to be with you because they don’t see you as, as, as high enough quality male.

Simone Collins: Yeah. Like if they’re not going to select you of their own free will, then you’re good. Just gonna have to select for them.

Malcolm Collins: Mm-hmm. Okay, [00:18:00] so what we could be seeing here is an adaptively like an adaptively evolve. So the way that it’s not just humans that evolve this way. Do you wanna read our book, the Pragma Heterosexuality?

You go into a lot more detail about how this works in other species. But species will change their behavior based on like the amount of resources in the environment. They’ll change the way they, they handle their social structures, they change the way they handle dominance conflicts, they change the way they make, right?

And it’s useful to have. Several pre-programmed patterns of arousal or behavior. It could be that humans are the same and that part. Of now note, I’m not saying that the social contagion thing isn’t real. I’m not saying that the a i, I think that there’s a lot of things that drive the modern trans movement.

You can look at any of our videos on this that we go into. Is it an alternative to unli of oneself? Yeah.

Simone Collins: When when you put large movements like this, it’s normally due to a confluence of factors. Just having it be one factor probably wouldn’t have turned it into the phenomenon. It is.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. [00:19:00] But what it might be.

For a portion which is leading to these way higher rates of what, what ala describes as brutal sexuality is a what’s the word I’m looking for here Is, is just an adaptive arousal pattern to feeling disempowered and like you don’t actually have a shot at reproducing.

Mm-hmm.

And. When I look at the types of people who transition just physiologically, they are disproportionately people who fall into this category.

Hmm.

And, and that’s when, when I was looking at that, I was like, oh my God, this makes so much sense. Right. Like, it could just be and, and. You could say that could also correlate with spiking race if people feel more disempowered now than they did historically, especially when you combine this with leftist cultural systems that tell you, you know, oh, you’ll never get ahead.

Oh, there’s no way out of this. Oh, life has no purpose except consumerism. You know, accept your own pleasure. I, I can see a person adapting to this really quickly. And then keep in mind, even if you are a [00:20:00] top dog leftist, right, you, you can still end up in behavior patterns, which might signal to your body that you’re not a top dog leftist.

So I’m gonna give an example here. Suppose your destiny, right? And you’re like. On stream. And there’s a famous one. There’s this guy who’s like, takes his wife or girlfriend in the back to have sex with her and he’s like laughing. He is like, oh, they’re gonna go have some fun.

Speaker 4: Okay. Mel, time. Why did I say this, Mel? Time.

Malcolm Collins: And a male’s body, that’s not supposed to happen, right?

Like, that’s not that, that, that’s your hormonal system telling you, even though you’ve got millions of people watching your stream. You are not gonna reproduce, you know, if, if this is the way that your partner is treating you and your, your, your social system is treating you, you’re not gonna reproduce.

And so, you might then adapt behaviors, physiology to say, Hey maybe I should, I should try some of the other strategies. Your, your facial features may even soften. Your expressions may soften. [00:21:00] Leading, leading to this stuff. So what are your thoughts, Simone?

Simone Collins: This makes a lot of sense to me. I mean, even just part of it being, if you can’t beat ‘em, join them.

But then that also producing more opportunities to actually reproduce. But yeah, I, I think you’re your bifurcated strategy of like either become a sneaky calculator by attempting to join female contingents as a female and reproduce sneakily that way, or. By just becoming super violent or possibly both.

That, that does make sense. I think the super violent part may have more, may make more sense among like the, the instances of, of there being more accusations of. Grape. Grape in like feminist circles. So yeah, we,

Malcolm Collins: we write about this in the book. If you look at the reported rates of grape within like feminist circles on college campuses, they’re like higher than like board foreign regions.

[00:22:00] Like Somalia. And so you could say they’re overreporting, which, you know, yeah, they

Simone Collins: probably, we have no doubt

Malcolm Collins: consider everything great these days. But it could also be that they have created communities where only people attempting sneaky copy strategies are going to enter. And these are people much more likely to push past.

Like to respect your boundaries. Respect your boundaries, respect your boundaries until you’re alone until they think that you can’t say anything about it. Right. And so many people have, have experienced this. And I, and I think that, that they might have actually created like you know, almost sort of like traps, like, like lobster traps for, for the, the, the sneaky calculators.

And, and why wouldn’t humans have a strategy like this? This is a perfectly viable strategy if you feel like you’re at the bottom of a totem pole of like a tribe or something like that. And, and a lot of humans throughout history were at the bottom of the totem pole, right? Like it made sense.

Simone Collins: Yeah, so it would also make sense that some, you know, that [00:23:00] the human population would evolve methods for dealing with that.

That, yeah, over time there would be adaptations and that not just one type of male, like the very, very lucky, but also very healthy and dominant males would manage to reproduce because. Luck only gets you so far. You know, like I, I almost feel like you would expect this form of male adaptation to be more dominant because either you get to be one of the very lucky but also genetically fit males that does reproduce like that one in 17 or whatever.

Or you happen to use any number of, of sneaky or clever or uniquely violent and aggressive methods to reproduce. And honestly, the latter seems a lot more easy and reproducible. Yeah, than like easier to replicate than the just be really lucky and [00:24:00] genetically fit pathway for reproducing as a male.

Malcolm Collins: Well, and I think that the reason why this strategy was not more prevalent in historic context when we’re looking at like, you know, history books is in part because it was so heavily punished. Like obviously it’s, it’s very bad for a society to be like, oh, look at these people dressed like women who are beating up, you know, quote unquote turfs in a rally or something.

Like normally, historically, there’s, there’s something in you when you see, when you see this and you’re just like. This is wrong. Like, yeah, this, we need to do something about the people who think that they can just walk up and start beating up a woman because they’re wearing a dress, right? Like, we need to, or that they can serially harass a woman like JK Rowling just because they’ve put on a dress, right?

Like, we need to , not have these people feel this empowered because they will then cross boundaries in other areas with women. Which, which we’ve repeatedly seen. There’s that recent thing at the gym where the, the. A [00:25:00] woman sits down, oh, naked next to the other woman in the gym, and the other woman’s like, can you please like leave me alone?

And they start like violently yelling at her.

Speaker 5: Today, I was naked in the locker room. I turned around and there’s a man there and boy like boy, clothes, lip gloss, standing there looking at me. I’m butt naked. So the first thing I think is maybe there’s a work doing in here. Maybe I miss the sign. I say the word sir, to say, sir, what are you doing in here?

He goes, don’t f*****g talk to me. I’m a woman. I have a right to be in here. Immediately I’m f*****g pissed because I’m butt, butt naked. I feel violated. I feel like weird.

Malcolm Collins: And it turned out that this person had previously broken his wife’s jaw. You know, like quite a violent person. Well, again, violent and these tendencies go go very, very hand in hand. So, and it, and it’s something that. Can cause you to have potentially more empathy because you can be like, Hey, it may not be their fault that this happened to them, but they’re still responsible for their actions in the [00:26:00] same way as a serial killer who was abused is, is, is still responsible.

If they then go on to abuse other people if they then, you know, go on to violate the consent of other people. So, what are my takeaways from this? My takeaway is I think that this is probably a factor. I don’t know if it’s one of the larger factors, but I think it’s a factor, especially for, for some individuals.

Agreed. And if it is a factor I think the best way to combat it. In regards to your kids is to, you know, educate them well on sexuality. And that means to, you know, let them know that there’s a, a, a variety of arousal systems. And they, and the most important thing about these arousal systems is one, they don’t choose them.

You know, they, they are sometimes a response to their environment. There’s sometimes a response to genes or sometimes a response to parasites.

Simone Collins: As we’ve covered in other episodes on that one was

Malcolm Collins: fascinating. Well, one of my favorite ones from the comment on the parasite video was a prison guard. And he said, I missed that one.

He goes, because we had talked about how like the two things, [00:27:00] one is, is that parasites might actually lead to cut behavior, like men wanting to cut a burn because they’re literally trying to give other people the parasites that their partners have that have now affected them. Is that I was like, yeah, people start this and then.

Later. And we also talked how it may be affecting same sex attracted communities. Later they end up becoming the, the, the cuckold. You know, they started the bold, they moved to the cuckold. Yeah. And so it’s like you, you know, as a prison guard there’s this. Adage, which is the person who stops on, starts on top, is always eventually on bottom.

What phenomenon, what, where you start on top with the guys who are open to it, who might have this gut pathogen that we talked about in that video. And eventually you wanna take it because you wanna spread the passage into other people who are Oh,

Simone Collins: wow.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. So I thought that was really fascinating. And it’d be interesting to do study. I mean, obviously you can’t do, everyone would freak out if you tried to do a study on this stuff these days because it’s so fascinating. But, but the larger [00:28:00] point being is, is, is in terms of my kids. How do I convey this in terms of them?

Because I think that’s the most important thing. I mean, that’s what I have control over. I can’t rewrite how society works, but I can e explain this to my kids. I, I’d one tell my daughters to be incredibly wary, much more wary than around conservative men around actively signaling feminist men. These men are very likely to be sex PEs.

I mean, again, look at like destiny. Yeah. That he filmed a bunch of girls without their consent and then shared the, the pornography of it. Like, yeah, that’s like, that’s, that’s something that, is really bad. Yes. That’s, that’s, that’s a, like an actively exploitative thing to do to these women. Yeah. And, and yet he’s constantly signaling I’m the, the greatest feminist, you know, of the, of ever.

Right. Yeah. So, so, one, be very, very wary of men like this. This is an active sexual strategy. Mm-hmm. And I’d say whatever you do, do not be alone with a man like that. Never be alone with a male feminist.

Yeah.

That’s number one. Two I’d also say be very, [00:29:00] very careful about being alone with trans women, to be honest.

I, I know that that’s a, a bad thing to say, but you, you could be putting yourself in danger. The, the. Next thing I’d say is because, you know, keep in mind with them, you reject them and all of a sudden, what are you transphobic? You know, they can begin to pressure you. And this is something that really happens to people, right?

You, you could be like, oh, it’s not all of them. And, and I guess here I’d be like, turn that old Tumblr meme back on it. Right? Here’s a bowl of Skittles. You know that? What is poison? You know, are you gonna eat from this? I

Simone Collins: don’t remember this.

Malcolm Collins: What they used this to talk about men and sexual violence. But the problem is, oh, and we have another episode on this that we’ll eventually do, but, but trans people always love to claim that they are victims of violence, much higher than other groups. And like they’re, they’re killed much higher. And we ran the stats in another episode. You can find the episode just by searching, or we’ll probably do a dedicated episode on this.

But if you actually look at the reported. Ho homicides of trans people in the United States. They are way lower than the general population. [00:30:00] Like way lower. I think it’s like an,

Simone Collins: that was bizarre. Yeah. Yeah.

Malcolm Collins: And, and it’s not just they’re way lower. It’s that they get comically lower. If you remove black trans women from the mix, which make up, I think it’s 70% of all trans homicides.

Because then if it’s, if you’re a white trans person, it’s like, what are these people like, invincible to bullets or something. Like, the numbers get so crazy at that point. So that’s just not true. It’s, it’s something that they want to portray is true, but it’s, it’s not, if you actually run the numbers, it’s not true.

So, the other thing that I would say to my kids is, you know, I, I, I think really important is if you have a, a certain sexual proclivity in regards to the pornography you’re consuming or erotic stories you’re consuming, like you’re a single woman and you really like the monster effort category of story.

That might not actually be what you still want when you are married and have kids. And it’s important to remember that a lot of [00:31:00] these arousal phases that you’re gonna go through throughout your life are transitory. They are not part of your identity. They are a response to your environment.

Simone Collins: Yeah. You, your body responding to.

Surrounding cues in a way that is supposed to optimize for your survival

Malcolm Collins: and reproduction. Yeah. Yeah. And I think that that’s, that’s really important because a lot of people they will consume these types of erotic stories like young women or young men. And then they’ll say, I want a woman like the, the who’s into the stuff that happens in my erotic material.

And or I want a man, a husband who’s into, into this stuff or represents these types of themes when you really should never, ever think about a long-term partner in those terms. The way you should think about a long-term partner is I. Who do I want to spend my life with outside of sex? Yeah.

Right. Like, that’s the who, who can, who do I have aligned goals with? Who do I have aligned mission with? Who would I be really happy if my kids [00:32:00] acted half the way they act and half the way I act? Right. You know, that’s gonna be where your partner comes into play, not in terms of the things that arouse you.

And so I think that that’s, that’s really important as well. And this is really important with, with, within another recent episode where you know, a guy. With, with saying you know, looking for kids, right? And he is like, well, like you really wanted kids. This isn’t our men. Or just, you know, outsourcing to, to women now just being like, Hey, we’re going to do surrogacy, right?

And women were like, oh, well, you really want kids to have met. I mean, I, I just have to ask because, you know, I really want kids and I’d be open to dating. Are you monogamous? And it’s like, well, you know, kind of, and it’s like. You as a male, especially if you’re in an environment where polyamory is normalized you are going to want to sleep around as much as possible of Of course.

That’s what your body wants. Yeah. And because you get away with it, you think, oh, this is a good way to. Live my life, but you’re not gonna attract a good long-term partner [00:33:00] if you are sick like that. Because women at that stage, when they’re looking for their long-term partner, they’re not gonna want somebody who’s also looking at that.

And I would say to you that you know, after your first few kids, you’re probably not gonna want to sleep around quite as much.

Simone Collins: Absolutely. It’s a pattern we’ve seen again and again.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. Anyway final thoughts, Simone?

Simone Collins: I think this is compelling and I am very curious to see how we view gender and sexuality like 20 years in the future.

Like if it’s just gonna, the wokes can’t

Malcolm Collins: change their mind on this stuff. They’re gonna like spiral out into some weird. Alternate what I think is gonna be clear to most people, a religious view on sexuality that is at odds with the real view of sexuality, which obviously branched from mainstream science with people like ala,

Simone Collins: maybe.

Yeah, I, I don’t know. I mean, I could also see it kind of going back [00:34:00] to the way it has been for most of history, which is like nobody really cares and people just kind of do what they wanna do. Like I could see it going to that. So there are still people who completely live transition lives as, as a different gender or some un gender, you know, where they’re non-binary or whatever.

Then people just like let them do their thing and, and that’s kind of way, I don’t think that

Malcolm Collins: that’s gonna happen.

Simone Collins: You don’t think so? You think it’s always gonna be politicized from now on?

Malcolm Collins: Well, so unfortunately, like. Society, me included in this. Like I used to s support very strongly transgender rights.

Yeah. Because they were like, Hey, you know, give us these rights and we won’t abuse them. And I was like, yeah, that sounds perfectly reasonable. Here’s the knife, buddy. You, you promised you were gonna stab, stab, stab, stab, stab. It’s like, whoa. Well what the heck were you, you said you weren’t gonna do that.

And you take the knife back and they’re like, how could [00:35:00] you do that? The, the, the trans person next to him, like, I didn’t stab anyone, was my knife. And it’s like, you didn’t try to stop the guy who was stabbing people. Right. You, you started yelling at me when I took away his knife. Mm-hmm. You know, and so, I think that.

So many young people, so especially young people. So if you’re watching this and you’re in my generation, you may not understand what it feels like to be a young cis person growing up in a place like the United States. But a lot of them say that they feel very marginalized. They feel as if they’re treated like second class citizens.

They feel that the trans people at their schools. And the gay people at their schools are treated like local celebrities and often abuse this, this, these positions that they’ve been given, which of course I wouldn’t, I mean, they’re kids who have been given positions of, of systemic privilege over other kids and that are not subject to the same disciplinary action as, as we saw locally.

Here were, you know, there was a young trans person who wrote a hit list and was caught with this hit list and the school did nothing, and then they tried to kill somebody on the hit list. [00:36:00]

Simone Collins: Oh goodness.

Malcolm Collins: They, they, they beat them severely. Was this

Simone Collins: recent?

Malcolm Collins: This was like last year. Okay. Gosh right near us.

And, and the reason why any other student gets caught with a hit list, they’re immediately out, right? Yeah. And so I think that a lot of the, the sort of older LGBT population is unaware. Of how abusive the younger LGBT population has been with the privileges that they won that population.

Hmm.

And so they don’t understand that.

Victimhood has been inverted between the two communities. And that what this means is a trans ideology or identity, unlike say you’re secretly into BDSM or you’re, you’re, you’re gay privately or whatever. And this is the thing with like gay people, if you look at like gay conservatives and there’s a lot of gay conservatives now, they look like.

Normal people. Right. And, and so, you know, I don’t think most conservatives are gonna treat them [00:37:00] particularly differently. If you look at gay like ultra progressives, they sort of brand themselves as in opposition. Two you know, o other cultural groups. And the problem with this sort of trans identity is it took that perspective and ran with it to such an extreme that the, the thing that I’ve, I’ve said before, it’s a bit like having a swastika carved in your forehead, you know, going forward, right?

Like, it’s like, oh, we remember all the things you guys did. I remember having to sit and watch that Olympics where the person who. Not even trans by the way, but the trans community decided to defend him. Just a biological male.

Simone Collins: Oh, the, yeah. The person who, well, I don’t think they realized it until later in their lives or something.

The boxer, right?

Malcolm Collins: No, no, no. I, he, there’s interviews of him being on TV shows in his home country where he is dressed as a man. He is calling himself. He, and they are calling him. Oh. Oh, really?

استضافتك وأتشرف باستضافة كذلك، مرحبا بك. شكرا لك أخي يوسف، وإن شاء الله

Malcolm Collins: He lived as a man and then just decided [00:38:00] to change for the Olympics. Oh, goodness.

I thought Asma gold stick on this was really brilliant because you could come at this and be like, well, are you saying that this person just shouldn’t be allowed to compete? Um, and it’s a bit like saying, oh, well there’s a seven foot boxer who wants to compete in the lightweight category, and he just.

Could not be that weight, ,, and be healthy or alive or anything like that. So what you’re saying, he just shouldn’t be allowed to do lightweight boxing, and it’s like, no, he just, lightweight boxing is a carve out category, and whenever you’re dealing with a carve out category, the carve out is always going to be to an extreme.

Arbitrary, but meant to preserve, you know, good sport. So a category of people that otherwise couldn’t compete, can compete, consider something like this, special Olympics. , If you go into the Special Olympics because you have a DD or something like that, and then somebody’s like, well. I understand it’s a disability, but it really shouldn’t qualify you for the Special Olympics [00:39:00] because in this huge other category of people isn’t going to be able to compete ever in any meaningful context.

, That’s a, that’s a valid claim by the other person. And then the person who has a DD says, what are you just saying? I shouldn’t be able to compete in anything. It’s like, no, you can compete in the regular Olympics. This person can just compete in mailbox boxing. Right? Like they don’t need to do this.

Right. Um, and it’s clear that, , if you allow people like this to compete, then the vast majority of women are not going to have a realistic chance. , And for people who are like, well, you know, trans people participating in sports aren’t that much of a problem. And it’s like, well, if they aren’t that much of a problem, if it really is not an issue at all, then why is nobody ever complaining about transmit?

I’ve, I’ve literally never seen that in sports. Oh, by the way, on this screen here, it’s a graph of male to female, , strengths, differences. And I think that this is why Dylan Mulvey’s 100 days of being a woman had so much of this energy to it.

[00:40:00] I wanna be in the Special Olympics Boo.

Malcolm Collins: Because he, he happened to be a man born with, with in all other things, male, except for being born with female genitalia.

And by, by this what I mean is chromosomally male, male in terms of testosterone, male in terms of body structure, male in terms of everything else. And, and we had to watch like on, on tv, like publicly for everyone to see. Him just like beating the snot out of women. We, we had to see those boxing matches where the, the cis women,

You know, fractured their, their skulls and stuff like that.

Like it, it looked horrifying, not great. Yeah. And then to see it cheered on and this is the same, people could be like, well, that’s a minority of the community that’s doing that. Yeah. But the majority in the dominant parts of the community are cheering it on. Okay. And they’re protecting these individuals, so they, and they

Simone Collins: just think that cannot be undone, basically.

Malcolm Collins: Right. They, through doing that absorb the sins in the same way that you guys freak out. If somebody even talks to Nick Fuentes, they absorb the sins of the [00:41:00] people that they are defending.

Hmm. I see.

They don’t say, Hey, actually they shouldn’t be doing this in the same way that we regularly say, Hey, Nick Fuentes shouldn’t be saying this.

Yeah.

They don’t do that. And, and, and for that reason, they are, they become responsible for the, the perpetration of these or, or they’ll freak out. Like when we did the episode on the trans mass shootings at schools and stuff and they were like, this, this isn’t true. This isn’t true, except we lay out the data very clearly in that episode.

Like it, I don’t understand. The data is incredibly clear in that episode. And, and they’re like, this isn’t true. And you get this mindset and the person literally asked an AI tell me this isn’t true. And so the AI told them it wasn’t true. So you get this mindset where they, they hide this and then kids die because we’re not addressing that.

There is a problem with mass shooters within specific sub communities.

Simone Collins: Yeah, not great. Not great.

Malcolm Collins: But, but I find what’s fascinating here is, you know, I talked about them being [00:42:00] at the bottom of the totem pole in terms of their actual ability to get women. I think one of the reasons why this adaptive sexuality is working so well is in this generation.

Is not only is it a strategy to get into like women’s only spaces, get women alone, stuff like that, but in a historic context, but in a modern time, it literally raises their status if they’re near the bottom of the social totem pole.

Simone Collins: Oh, yeah. Okay, I see what you’re saying. So yeah, it, it is both a way to gain access to women only spaces to gain the opportunity, but it’s also at the same time.

It’s a dual strategy. At least you have access if you wanna be sneaky, but also it’s like a backdoor way to get higher status. And maybe through that mean, even without non-consent, even without sneaky population, you end up securing partners because it is, I mean, that is a trend. It seems like a lot of men who go trans end up with female partners.

Which is interesting. Yeah, I guess not necessarily what I [00:43:00] would’ve expected,

Malcolm Collins: huh anyway, so for dinner tonight

Simone Collins: We’re doing more bok choy specific, like one and, and more beans sprouts this time, right?

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. Did we already saw the, the beef?

Simone Collins: Yeah. So, unless you wanna, I can just leave that thought in the fridge and then.

Malcolm Collins: No, no, no, no. I want it with the beef. I was gonna say, if you didn’t thaw the beef, I would’ve just had it with the leaves. No

Simone Collins: protein at all.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah, but I’m okay if we got the beef out. It’s good.

Simone Collins: Okay.

Malcolm Collins: And the, the bok choy was good last time. The, the beans straps were good. Are you hungry enough

Simone Collins: for, for protein or are you like just not very hungry tonight, or?

Malcolm Collins: Well, I was thinking like less because I was like, well, I may not want that much, but if I don’t want that much, then I’ll just say it for tomorrow. Okay.

Simone Collins: Well, I can, yeah. I, I didn’t thaw very much for what it’s worth. Like I, like I did about half as much as I did last night.

Malcolm Collins: Oh, okay. Yeah, that’s what I want is half as much as last night.

Just,

Simone Collins: just a smacker of meat as it were. Not very much at all. Yeah.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. Yeah. That’s great. Okay, good. And beef wraps and you know, [00:44:00] maybe one of the long hots or something.

Simone Collins: Okay. Yeah. Yeah. I can do all that. And then with, there was still some, some of the sauce that I’d pre-mixed left over, right?

Or should I make more?

Malcolm Collins: I don’t know. Okay. Depends on how much you’re cooking.

Simone Collins: What kind of sauce do you want me to make? If I need to make more?

Malcolm Collins: The black pepper sauce is the best. Black pepper, like stir fried steak, black pepper steak.

Simone Collins: All right, then I will work on that for you. Hope you, I hope you enjoy.

I hope you enjoy. I always do. We have fun going. Me too, Malcolm. I love you. Thanks for not being trans.

Malcolm Collins: Well, you technically are.

Simone Collins: Oh yeah. Well we’re, we’re both technically non-binary, I guess. ‘cause we just don’t care. But I think that’s very well that

Malcolm Collins: makes, that makes you a gen. Yeah, I’d be agent, I, I literally don’t care.

I’m like, I’m happy to [00:45:00] just, just, I will do what my gender tells me to do because that is the way I’m supposed to live my life. And if I was a woman tomorrow, I would do what my gender told me to do.

Simone Collins: Well it’s, it’s just easier to like. Yeah, what you have would be asexual,

Malcolm Collins: which makes you age, which makes you gender queer, which makes you

Simone Collins: non-binary

Malcolm Collins: and genderqueer non-binary and, and, and trans by their, everyone’s trans by their ideology.

That, that’s just the way it is. What I mean is almost anyone can find a way to, to categorize themselves as, as trans. Oh, oh. I’m not really into sex until y and that makes me trans because I’m a demisexual. Oh.

Simone Collins: Right. Like, yeah,

Malcolm Collins: yeah,

Simone Collins: yeah, yeah. No matter what, there’s always some condition like, well, I, I don’t like having sex with animals.

Well, that makes you some kind of. Sexual orientation, which therefore,

Malcolm Collins: I don’t know, whatever. You don’t like having sex with animals? Simone, you are a true deviant. Yeah. Did you are a white [00:46:00] woman, do you not know that it’s its ability to have sex with dogs? I have. I have learned this about middle aged white women.

A disability. God.

Simone Collins: Oh God. There are so many things. I don’t wanna, I’m gonna go pick Holly and decorate our house. That’s what I’m gonna for. You gotta beautiful holly

Malcolm Collins: tree right outside her house.

Simone Collins: Yeah, the berries are on it. It just looks so pretty. I feel like we need to deck the halls deck, those getting halls, Simone with With bows of Holly.

Actual bows of

Malcolm Collins: Holly.

Simone Collins: Yeah. F Allah. Malcolm

Malcolm Collins: F Allah, yourself.

Simone Collins: Yeah. Well, I love you.

Malcolm Collins: I love you too. Thanks.

Simone Collins: This was interesting.

Malcolm Collins: All right. You had a poo situation, you say, well, the baby,

Simone Collins: some people here did

Malcolm Collins: we do not do a good job advertising. Being parents, people, people look at us and they go, oh gosh,

Simone Collins: no, no, no, no, no. He’s a, he’s a great [00:47:00] representative of baby kind.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. Somebody else recently had a kid and they’re like, wow, how do you get ‘em to stop crying?

Like they always want my attention.

Simone Collins: They do, but that’s ‘cause they’re cute at

Malcolm Collins: this age. I hate the, at I, I’m like, guys are just not programmed to deal with the first like, year and a half of life. It is so hard for men to do. I can’t deal with it. If you didn’t handle it. Oh my god. I, I’d I just still want kid.

You’d deal,

Simone Collins: you would deal with it. You would. I figure it out. I

Malcolm Collins: figured it out. But it’s hard. Because yeah, just like even just sitting there until they’re done drinking. Like I, I just, ugh, I can’t too much.

Simone Collins: I was recently watching an asthma gold video, like half paying attention, and he was playing a video game with like an Asian character that was carrying a baby on his chest.

And part of me wondered if it was like part of. That’s death standing. It’s death standing.

Malcolm Collins: Death standing. Is that one that I told you about that like everyone expected to bomb with a Camilla game. A Joe Camina. Did [00:48:00] people

Simone Collins: like it in the end? Oh

Malcolm Collins: yeah. Became super popular. Everyone was like, oh, this game’s gonna do terrible.

It’s weird and whatever. And like, he’s known for just like doing his own thing. And this was his first project he made after leaving like major studios. Okay. He is the one who made like metal gear solid and stuff. Very

cute baby in them. The,

Simone Collins: the

Malcolm Collins: character was the baby in like a, a, a suspended in liquid, right?

Simone Collins: No, no, no, no. Not that one. No, this was a different one. It was like some, some Asian guy and he had a baby, like in a carrier on the front while he was doing sword fight.

Malcolm Collins: That might have been a one of the, I forget what they’re called, Samari something game.

Simone Collins: Yeah. They seemed like they didn’t seem Japanese.

They seemed like Chinese warriors of some sort.

Malcolm Collins: Well, that’s, that’s fun. Yeah. Gotta add that to every video game, just so guys. No, I, I identify as somebody carrying a baby can, you know, and it wasn’t

Simone Collins: just like a, a, a non-active, like the, the baby would start crying if it got a little too distressed or something.

Like, [00:49:00] at least in the opening scene. So I

Malcolm Collins: love, like, you know, the baby, my wife watches Asma Gold and it’s just like, Hey, did you see the as asthma gold? When we were doing the other day, the the Trump whatever thing, and I was like, yeah, did you watch the Tucker Carlson video? And she’s like, yeah. And I go, well, I, I, I watched next coverage of it.

And she goes, yeah, I watched notes coverage too. And that’s how we’re consuming our news of other streamers

Simone Collins: through the lens of. Streamers. Yeah, I think that’s how a huge number of people consumes their news when like Pew surveys report that people are getting their news from social media. I think most people think, and of course a lot of it is coming from just TikTok.

That’s how your mom was giving a lot of news before she passed, but she consumed all channels to be fair. And a lot of people for sure are on Facebook, but I think a growing number of people are consuming their news through people like Aspen Gold and I mean, if they’re on the left, people like Hassan Piker or [00:50:00] maybe Destiny, or maybe, you know, does Young Turks even count as social media?

Probably still, but yeah, I mean, it’s these channels.

Malcolm Collins: Hmm. Well, all right, Simone. I’ll get started here. Yes.

Kid Time: I got the gun. No, you have to. You gotta to take the glass out first. That’s his gun. His gun? Yeah. Get the glass out so he can fight for you.

Stay here and do it. Lemme go. Look at his so f*****g the grass. There’s only one glass. Get that one glass. It’s right here. Right there. No, here. Oh, [00:51:00] thanks. Thanks. You had glass stuck in your toasty. I was acting like glass.

Oh, is it a sleep? Poison. No, those doors before

then. Then wake up. Oh, okay. And this is my son.

This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit basedcamppodcast.substack.com/subscribe