#239: Measurement | In this Exit Five live session, Dave sits down with Pranav Piyush, Co-Founder & CEO of Paramark (ex-PayPal, Dropbox, Adobe, BILL), to talk about the future of B2B marketing measurement.

Spoiler alert: it’s not clicks.

They break down why the old way of doing attribution doesn’t cut it anymore and why leading B2B teams are shifting toward incrementality, experimentation, and marketing mix modeling.

Dave and Pranav also cover:

• The gaps in the old way of doing attribution
• What the best B2B marketing teams are doing now for attribution
• The key questions CMOs face from boards and execs about measurement
• Three things you can do this quarter to improve your measurement

Timestamps

• (00:00) - – Intro to Pranav
• (04:33) - – The Purple Cow mindset: why differentiation matters more than ever
• (06:13) - – Pranav’s background (PayPal, Dropbox, Adobe, BILL → Paramark)
• (07:18) - – “Measurement is Robin. Creative is Batman.”
• (08:33) - – Why click/touch attribution is flawed and misleading
• (12:03) - – The 95/5 rule: most of your audience isn’t in-market…yet
• (14:48) - – How top brands (Asana, DoorDash, P&G) measure beyond attribution
• (16:13) - – What is incrementality and why it’s more useful than attribution
• (18:33) - – Why revenue isn’t always the right KPI - especially in long sales cycles
• (20:33) - – Intro to marketing mix modeling (MMM) and how it works
• (22:33) - – Visualizing baseline vs. incremental impact on pipeline
• (23:48) - – Geo testing: how to prove a channel’s impact without attribution tools
• (25:48) - – The branded search trap: why you should test turning it off
• (28:18) - – Even Meta, Google, LinkedIn admit attribution is flawed
• (29:03) - – How to measure untrackable stuff (organic, content, social)
• (32:33) - – Why “credit” kills performance
• (34:23) - – Measurement for startups
• (37:18) - – What to do if all you track is closed-won revenue
• (39:03) - – Why attribution software is overkill under $100K in spend
• (40:18) - – Should you ask “How did you hear about us?”
• (43:03) - – How to carve out budget for channel testing
• (45:43) - – Don’t skip audience research
• (49:03) - – Creativity is still your #1 growth lever (measurement just supports it)
• (50:33) - – Wrap-up and final takeaways

Send guest pitches and ideas to hi@exitfive.com
Join the Exit Five Newsletter here: https://www.exitfive.com/newsletter
Check out the Exit Five job board: https://jobs.exitfive.com/
Become an Exit Five member: https://community.exitfive.com/checkout/exit-five-membership

***

Today’s episode is brought to you by Grammarly.

Ever have one of those weeks where you spent more time replying to Slack and email than doing actual marketing work?

You’re not alone. The average marketing team spends 28+ hours a week just keeping up with comms.

That leads to burnout, frustration, and a whole lot of performative productivity that doesn’t actually move the needle.

AI-fluent marketing teams are changing that. Grammarly’s 2025 Productivity Shift Report shows how they’re using AI to:

– Cut down on back-and-forth

– Automate content, research, and reporting

– Eliminate busywork

– Make space for strategy

We’re marketers because we love crafting campaigns, driving revenue, and proving impact – not spending all day buried in messages.

Get the report and see how top teams are making AI actually useful.

Visit go.grammarly.com/exitfive to grab it.

***

Thanks to my friends at hatch.fm for producing this episode and handling all of the Exit Five podcast production.

• They give you unlimited podcast editing and strategy for your B2B podcast.
• Get unlimited podcast editing and on-demand strategy for one low monthly cost. Just upload your episode, and they take care of the rest.
• Visit hatch.fm to learn more