I think it's useful to have a thought experiment here, which is that imagine that you literally could save someone's life instead of buying yourself some ice cream. There's something horrifying about that, that choice to buy ice cream rather than saving someone's life. And I think what can happen to some of the fact of Altra is that they start seeing that as a genuine trade-off. They start saying, well, you know what? If I took this money and I went and helped people, maybe I could save a life. Okay, maybe not for the price of ice cream, but, you know, maybe for a few thousand dollars I could savea life.

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