Yeah, so much of this resonates with someone told me a while ago to focus on pain points more than personas and I feel like this process that people can check out in the blog post that I've shared will really help them get to that idea of like soul for pain as opposed to necessarily a persona because I personally think you have more impact that way. And at this point we know about the context we know why it matters we know these three layers how do we then take that context and transfer it to our learning experiences and what some of the tools are advice for people to do that. Yeah, I think

first it's about getting everybody on the same page oftentimes what happens is we're looking at, you know, different parts of the elephant so somebody's just looking at the tail, somebody's looking at the eye, and you know that cartoon that exists so it's often that internally within the team were not aligned on who are we designing for and why are we trying to solve this problem right. So I think the first step is trying to make whatever that understanding is a lot more visible. And in the article there are some frameworks that I have used quite often across different kinds of projects to kind of do that but needless to say that there are so many other things that you can do to make that more visible. And so that is also to constantly keep defining and redefining who you're like what your context is and who you're, you know, and learners are, because I feel like over time that also keeps changing so context is not stationary, it will keep changing over and to almost recognize that the fact that it is going to be dynamic is kind of another thing to sort of, you know, keep in

mind. Yeah, is there any advice for people on how they can keep up with changing context because I do agree it's easy to get into this idea if you defined what the context is and before you know a bunch of stuff has changed in the company without you noticing it and the context is shifted while you haven't been able to keep pace with it. So any thoughts on how we can really keep an eye on that as it changes and evolves

over time. Yeah, so I mean, I think as you're designing different kinds of experiences, a good exercise that I've found to do at the very beginning is kind of defined what are the constraints that we're working within now those constraints could be behaviors that we've seen they could be time available they could be other patterns that we found in the context or like ecosystem trends etc. And then we almost have a list of that at the beginning of every project and as a kind of horizontal exercise across different courses that you might be designing or different experiences that you that you design, you can almost keep tweaking that larger kind of contextual understanding that you have. And if there are different people that are working on different types of courses and might be understanding the context in their own where good exercises also to find space to sort of come together. So you know, where you exchange notes and almost allow for that kind of cross learning within the within the company as well.

Again, you've got a really useful tool, which is this empathy map. So my last question for you is actually is part of this as well. Just building your own skill of empathy so you can build a better understanding with people and therefore it's far easier to notice changes it's far easier to understand context if you're empathetic to your end user or your

learner. I think I like to summarize it in again like one line first who then what and if we just remember that then I think everything else will kind of fall into place.

Awesome.