Category vs sub-category distinctions

#322 | Louis Grenier joins Dave for a conversation about what it actually takes to stand out in B2B marketing when everything feels the same. Louis sent Dave 10 surprise gifts to open during the show, and each one sparks a conversation about marketing, career, and life. They talk about the reality of how people decide to buy and why Louis is so focused on timeless fundamentals.

Timestamps

• (00:00) - — Timeless marketing vs the AI hype
• (05:24) - — The colonoscopy story.
• (12:44) - — Trojan Horse marketing. Get attention first. Sell later. Stop leading with your product.
• (17:44) - — Why you can’t create demand, only redirect it.
• (23:24) - — Category creation vs sub-categories. Most startups get this wrong.
• (26:14) - — Meaning-free brand assets. Why weird mascots and visuals actually work.
• (33:18) - — How to sell bold ideas internally without asking for permission.
• (37:08) - — Ads that look like ads fail. Attention is the job.
• (45:48) - — Triggers vs pain points. How people actually decide to buy.
• (51:08) - — First principles, repetition, history, and why this stuff still works no matter the tech wave.

Join 50,0000 people who get Dave's Newsletter here: https://www.exitfive.com/newsletter
Learn more about Exit Five's private marketing community: https://www.exitfive.com/

***

Brought to you by:

Optimizely - A no-code AI platform where autonomous agents execute marketing work across webpages, email, SEO, and campaigns. Get a free, personalized 45-minute AI workshop to help you identify the best AI use cases for your marketing team and map out where agents can save you time at optimizely.com/exitfive.

AirOps - The content engineering platform that helps marketers create and maintain high-quality, on-brand content that wins AI search. Go to airops.com/exitfive to start creating content that reflects your expertise, stays true to your brand, and is engineered for performance across human and AI discovery.

Visit exitfive.com/retreat to apply for Exit Five’s first-ever, in-person Marketing Leadership Retreat, March 18–20, 2026 in Scottsdale, Arizona. Join 100 CMOs and VPs of Marketing from companies like like Zoom, Snowflake, Manychat, Bitly, G2, HP, and more for two days of thinking bigger around a trusted group of peers in marketing. 

***

Thanks to my friends at hatch.fm for producing this episode and handling all of the Exit Five podcast production.

• They give you unlimited podcast editing and strategy for your B2B podcast.
• Get unlimited podcast editing and on-demand strategy for one low monthly cost. Just upload your episode, and they take care of the rest.
• Visit hatch.fm to learn more