Zelensky's Evolving Leadership

Ending the war in Ukraine very much depends on how and when President Vladimir V. Putin of Russia allows it to end.

In an interview for his podcast “The Ezra Klein Show,” the opinion columnist Ezra Klein spoke with one of the world’s leading experts on Mr. Putin, Fiona Hill, a foreign policy adviser for three United States presidents.

Today, we run the discussion between Ms. Hill and Ezra Klein about how Mr. Putin is approaching this moment, and the right and wrong ways for the West to engage him. 

Guest: Fiona Hill, a senior fellow at the Center on the United States and Europe at the Brookings Institution.

Have you lost a loved one during the pandemic? The Daily is working on a special episode memorializing those we have lost to the coronavirus. If you would like to share their name on the episode, please RECORD A VOICE MEMO and send it to us at thedaily@nytimes.com. You can find more information and specific instructions here.

Background reading: 

• Here’s a guide to the roots of the Ukraine war.
• About two-thirds of Ukraine’s population of 44 million people lived in cities before Russia’s invasion began. Now, many urban areas are in the cross hairs of war. What cities is Russia targeting?

Want more from The Daily? For one big idea on the news each week from our team, subscribe to our newsletter. 

For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily. Transcripts of each episode will be made available by the next workday. 

Unlock full access to New York Times podcasts and explore everything from politics to pop culture. Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify.