So would you read a poem of yours? Iask you to bring something, yes. And is this something you've written recently? Yes,

it's not that long. And i cant. Have only been reading it in the last year or so. It's a sonnet, 14 lines, called the life line. Here is what i know when that bell tolls again, i need to go and make something, anything, a poem, a pie, a terrible scarf, with my terrible knitting. I need to write a letter, remind myself of any little life line around me. When death sounds, i forget most of what i learnt before i go below. I compare my echoes with other people's happiness. I carve that hole in my own chest, pull out all my organs once again, wonder if they'll ever work again, stuff them back again, begin again. Why

did you choose that?

Well, for me, it's a poem, a consolation. I wrote it for a friend, dave, and he'd been going through something, and i was feeling like i wanted to can be in solidarity with a friend who is struggling. And so i wrote it kind of as a way of saying, i know what it's like to be in a circumstance where you feel like, oh k, here we are again, and i don't want to be there the way that creativity can often be the first thing to be forgotten when you're in a time of constraint or a time of difficulty or demand that can be agre for that can be anything. You know, you might be caught up in a cycle of comparison, or caught up in a way where you just think, oh, i'm never going to change. Whatever it is, the creative impulse can be the m the first thing to be forgotten, even though it can be the first thing that might help you recover yourself. And i think there's something for me in the constant reminder, to remind yourself that the creative is not just decoration. It's not just a luxury. The creative is an element. And the creative doesn't have to mean, i'm going to go and write an orchestral suite. It might be, you know, i'm going to make a scarf with my terrible knitting for intance, or a pie, or write a letter, or do anything where you can see i participated in creating that. And that's a relationship with yourselfam, and somehow there is a satisfaction that that can also then burgen the satisfaction for making justice, for making change, for making a movement.