And perhaps one of the critiques or problems that may come out of Bergson's thought is these escalating orders of perceptual hierarchy for lack of a better term, because one of the things that he seems to say is that as our consciousness or our awareness is able to circumscribe more and more sense data or details about reality, there's a certain underlying ethical implication, which is, well, that creates a greater kind of being. And one of the things that I think about quite a bit, especially with relation to phenomenology is, you know, like disability theory. And you're encounter with Bergson, or even in your own engagement with Bergson. What do you think are some of the ethical upshots of this? And do you think that Bergson's thought maybe not only Bergson himself, but phenomenology broadly construed is challenged

by some of like disability theorists? I certainly do. And maybe I can unpack a bit about how we get there and then answer that. So, you know, Bergson is an early gestalt, we could say, view of physiology and psychology, meaning that instead of seeing atomic parts being put together in an abstract kind of information processing system, everything is a globally organized whole, where the whole is greater than the sum of the parts and is orchestrated in time, these kinds of ideas. So perceptual, our perceptual system is in dialogue and is an open system with respect to its environment. You know, we have all these images in gestalt psychology, where the duck rabbit or whatever, and we're having a gestalt shift in our perception. This idea of gestalt shift in perception is essential for Bergson. Like, we have the propensity to alter the way that we perceive the world. And this is essential for things like invention and bringing about novelty and creating a new future. Elia Ausagie is a scholar working in this area. She is an amazing article called The Ethics of Hesitation. And it's all about shifting the way that we perceive. And in this particular context, it's about like racialized perception and being able to interrupt the habits of perception. So this is saying that perception isn't just this accepting of data into our, you know, organs, but that it's always shaped by a cultural historical set of interpretive structures. And phenomenology, you know, the Merle-Ponty and then this aspect of Bergson, offer us a way of understanding this, you could say, the moral dimension of attention, that there's a way of shifting our attention and that hesitating being, creating an interval between sensation and reaction. Racialized perception, for instance, is already set up to respond to a stimuli in a certain way. She looks at like the headdresses in France, which caused an uproar and this kind of thing. And like, how can we actually use a shift in gestalt of perception to interrupt these racializing perceptions? You know, a favorite topic here on

our show is dreams and fantasies and the imagination.