In episode seven we delve into the sector that has the biggest pieces of statecraft in budgetary terms - governance and public administration programs. These programs showcase the inner works of bureaucracy and have ubiquitous influence in the Pacific. Gordon Peake has been trying to explain to his parents, in laws and kids what he does for a living all the time seized with worry as to whether all the governance programs he has been involved in add up to much.

He goes to find out more about governance and whether it influences by talking with Graham Teskey - Governance Technical Lead at Abt Australia, Graeme Smith - Associate Professor at the Australian National University, Paula Torres - Reporter, Godfree Kaptigau - Freelancer, Joseph Nobetau - Former Papua New Guinea Chief Migration Officer and Ruth Kissam - Community Organiser. Special guests include Charles and Patrick Peake.

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.