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Episode 30: Tom Campbell

Rupert Spira Podcast

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The Materialist's View of Matter

In my model, matter is computed. It's a virtual reality. There is no matter. Matter is an illusion,. Just like your elf running around in the world of Warcraft is an illusion. It doesn't exist. How do we know? The reason why I would suggest that materialist view is wrong is because we have no evidence of anything outside consciousness. Another substance, an ontological primitive outside consciousness, was simply an abstract idea. That would be the argument that I would use to refute the materialist's claim in the existence of matter. But then you're using the same argument to suggest that there may be something outside consciousness. You don't think so?" he asks. "There

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