With NLW currently on the road, he's joined in this conversation by Sean “Swyx” Wang — developer, writer, Latent Space host and newly joined member of Cognition. They explore how AI coding became 2025’s defining story, why “vibe coding” is ending (sort of), what comes next for developers, and how “Agent Labs” are reshaping the balance between model makers and product builders. Swyx also previews the upcoming AI Engineer Code Summit in New York and shares why “code AGI” could deliver 80% of AGI’s value long before full AGI arrives.

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