Apps Win Over Infrastructure for Value Capture

This week, Santi joined Jonah & Avi on the 1000x podcast to discuss Bitcoin breaking $95k, why crypto valuations are struggling, how AI and traditional markets offer better value and clearer cash-flow stories, and why the next era of winners will be real applications, not infrastructure. Enjoy!

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Zcash is encrypted Bitcoin. Your digital bill of rights securing your freedom for the 21st century.

Buy, store and spend ZEC privately using Zashi Wallet download today: https://electriccoin.co/zashi/

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Katana is a DeFi-first chain built for deep liquidity and high yield. No empty emissions, just real yield and sequencer fees routed back to DeFi users.

Pre-deposit now: Earn high APRs with Turtle Club [https://app.turtle.club/campaigns/katana] or spin the wheel with Katana Krates [https://app.katana.network/krates]

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Mantle is pioneering ""Blockchain for Banking"" as a revolutionary new category that sits at the intersection of TradFi and web3.

Key elements for Mantle as the ""Blockchain for Banking"":

Transactions posted to the blockchain

Compatibility with TradFi rails

Integrated DeFi features

Mantle Network, the access layer — transforms Mantle Network into a purpose-built vertical platform — the blockchain for banking — that enables financial services on-chain. Mantle leads the establishment of Blockchain for Banking as the next frontier.

Follow Mantle on X (@Mantle_Official) for the latest updates on Mantle as the 'Blockchain for Banking'.

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Timestamps:

(00:00 Introduction

(01:11) Crypto’s Valuation Problem

(04:41) Crypto vs the Stock Market

(07:55) Crypto’s Valuation Problem Cont.

(12:49) Ads (Zcash, Katana)

(14:03) Is This Time Different?

(18:19) Valuations vs Active Users

(21:33) Future of Blockchain

(25:12) Bitcoin vs Crypto

(29:07) Crypto Needs Cash Flows

(32:24) Ads (Zcash, Katana)

(33:38) Underwriting New Chains

(40:52) Western Union Thesis

(43:58) Equity vs Token Holders

(46:30) The Future of Blockchain Investments

(49:46) Missing the Forest for the Trees

(54:06) Ads (mantle)

(55:05) Still Bullish Bitcoin

(59:20) Institutional Interest in Crypto

(01:05:26) Final Thoughts

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Disclaimer: Nothing said on Empire is a recommendation to buy or sell securities or tokens. This podcast is for informational purposes only, and any views expressed by anyone on the show are solely our opinions, not financial advice. Santiago, Jason, and our guests may hold positions in the companies, funds, or projects discussed.