Do emotions like vengeance and hatred contribute ultimately to well-being if well-being is considered in more Aristotelian kind of human flourishing kind of terms? I think there are two debates we've been having too much. You're trying to convince us that those actions were caused and us trying to convince or at least me trying to convince you that they were ultimately caused and beyond our control. We need to wrap up the progress but also stop talking in circles now, he says.

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