How Did You Find Copywriting?

Liv Steigrad is our guest on the 314th episode of The Copywriter Club Podcast. Liv is a copywriter and brand messaging strategist with a psychology and sociolinguistic background. She helps her clients create powerful brands through her B.R.A.V.E framework, and in this episode, she breaks down how copywriters can use it to build their own brands. Here’s how the conversation went: Does a psychology degree help in being a better copywriter? How to get better at voice of customer research. Making friends as an adult and applying the same techniques in networking. How to prepare and execute things that are terrifying. The one habit you need to build to gain momentum in your business and life. Do you have a definition of success? And is it really true to you? What is a brand story and why does it matter? How to envision big goals and create your ideal day. The balance between a full-time job and a full-time business. What you need to take advantage of while you’re working a full-time job. What is brand strategy and how in-depth does it get? How to make microcopy both functional and filled with brand personality. The B.R.A.V.E framework – How to apply it for your personal brand. Why brand strategy is essential and how to communicate its value to prospects. Where are most copywriters struggling with UX? BE BOTHERED – How this simple phrase will help boost your business. The two business lessons Liv learned from gymnastics. When your mindset wavers… Remember this. Hit play to listen to the episode. The people and stuff we mentioned on the show: The Copywriter Think Tank Kira’s website Rob’s website Liv's website The Copywriter Club Facebook Group The Copywriter Underground Free month of Brain.FM Episode 118 Episode 187 Episode 215 Jenn's website Full Transcript: Kira Hug:  When's the last time you felt bothered by something? Doesn't matter if we're talking about client acquisition or friendship, which we actually talk about a good amount in this episode, because let's face it, friendship is hard as an adult. It pays in multiple ways to be bothered, to speak up, and to show you care for the clients and friends in your business and life. And today's guest knows a lot about not only being a great friend but also about how to be brave in business and life. This branding strategist isn't afraid to terrify herself on a regular basis. This could look like stepping on a stage to do spoken word poetry, or doing a backflip, or traveling in a foreign country alone, or even building a business that's different from everyone else's business. In today's episode of The Copywriter Club podcast, you are in for a treat with brand strategist, gymnast, and all-around brave copywriter Liv Steigrad. Rob and I have had the luck of getting to know Liv in our Think Tank Mastermind and every time I spend time with her, I feel inspired to be more brave in my own business and life. Stay tuned because you won't want to miss this conversation. All right, so today I have a special co-host. I'm really excited to chat through this episode with Jenn Jouhseik, a personality-driven copywriter, and brand storyteller, and an incredible email copywriter as well. I know we don't want to give you three titles Jenn, but I feel like I have to mention email because you are a prolific email writer as well. So Jenn, thanks for being with me to talk through this episode. I appreciate it. Jenn Jouhseik:  Of course. So happy to be here. Kira Hug:  All right, so before we start to talk and dissect this conversation, I just want to mention that, of course, the podcast is sponsored by The Think Tank, which is our Mastermind Program. And Jenn, you are a member of The Think Tank. So I'm just going to ask you a question about it. From your experience, what has been the biggest benefit to your business from being in a Mastermind like The Think Tank? Jenn Jouhseik:  Oh, there are so many things. Definitely, the community has been huge. Working on a business no one tells you how lonely it is, and so being able to be surrounded by so many different copywriters and just being able to connect with a bunch of different copywriters that are going in different directions and bringing different ideas to the table, it really shows you all the different opportunities that you can do to take your business in whatever direction that feels good to you. And I think that that is really special. And just having that support, someone to listen to, and the accountability has been phenomenal. Kira Hug:  And I'm curious, Jenn, so what have you focused on in your business that maybe you weren't expecting to focus on initially when you joined? Have there been any surprises for you along the way? Jenn Jouhseik:  There have been quite some surprises actually. I started off with my focus primarily on brand messaging and voice and web copy. And I recently took a pivot into email, which is something that I wanted to explore, but was too afraid to do it, actually. And so it was a really nice opportunity to pivot that way and to grow my skills as well as just connect with other members of The Think Tank and learn from them and really push myself further than I normally have. And definitely one of the things that I probably wasn't planning on was doing speaking opportunities, and I found that I actually really like them. So it's been a pleasant surprise that I'm shocked about because I am not a great public speaker, but I really do enjoy speaking. And so that's definitely something I want to explore more. Kira Hug:  Thank you for sharing, Jenn. So if you're listening and you have any interest in being part of a Mastermind and focusing on some big goals in your business and maybe you even want to feel a little surprised by what you can accomplish and see is possible for your business, you can check it out and reach out to our team at help@thecopywriterclub.com to send our team an email and mention you're interested in The Think Tank and we can jump on a call and chat about it with you. All right, so let's jump into the conversation with Liv. Liv Steigrad:  I always loved writing, I always knew I wanted to do it, but when I was younger, I didn't know what my options were. I thought I could only be a novelist and I was never about that struggling artist life. So I went and studied psychology at Uni instead and quickly decided that that career path was not for me. Even though I love the field of it, I just never felt qualified to actually get inside people's heads in that way. So then I got an internship at a publication and learned a bit more about media and then that helped me get a job, a couple of days a week at a magazine. And then I came across copywriting in a Facebook group and I was like, oh, what's this? And then I started googling it and I was like, I think I'm already doing this and I want to do more of this, and I feel like I could make good money doing this, which was a total revelation. It was like the sun coming through the clouds for the first time. And so I didn't know how to get a job in it, so I decided to give myself a job in it and started my business. Rob Marsh:  I love that. So, the psychology background has me intrigued. Obviously, you didn't want to pursue that as a career path, but how does the psychology degree that you hold inform what you do as a copywriter? Liv Steigrad:  Not in the way that everyone thinks, and I don't know if I should say this in a podcast, which I don't know how many people are going to listen to. Rob Marsh:  You should definitely say it. Liv Steigrad:  Most people when they hear that are like, oh wow, you understand how people behave and you understand people's motivations. Sometimes people are like, oh, you can read minds. None of that is true. A degree in psychology is way more technical and way more scientific than people think. And the human behavior part is one top out of 20. But the part that I do use is the research. So one of the assignments that I had to do was called the systematic review, which is basically finding all of the available research on a topic and putting it into this table and finding the common themes. And that is basically how I now do my Voice of Customer research. And I use that mindset and that methodology in my brand strategy and how I analyze things these days as well. But all of my psychology skills that I actually use in copywriting, I have learned just from being a good friend and receiving therapy. Those soft skills of how to listen, how to pick up on what people are feeling, how to interpret people's behavior and apply that to how they might be feeling and all of that, I did not learn it in a psychology degree. Kira Hug:  Okay, well can you help us become better friends? How to be a good friend is hard. It's hard for me at least. And I feel like you're very in tune with that. And so, how can we become better friends to our friends? Liv Steigrad:  It's actually really easy. You just have to be bothered. And I apply that philosophy to everything in my life. Just be bothered. Just care. It is cool to care. It is cool to show it. It is cool to put in the effort. It is cool to take the time and think about your friends and if you can't remember their birthday, write it down. Follow up on things. If your friend's not feeling fine, do something nice for them. Send them $5 and tell them to buy a coffee on you. Be the person that does those little things that you hear about or you see in movies that don't seem to happen in real life that much. You can just be that person and you can just be bothered and that will make you in the top 1% of friends. Rob Marsh:  Yeah, I think my problem is that I'm bothered by the other definition. I'm bothered instead of the way you're using it, Liv, yeah.