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18min chapter
S15, Ep9 How To Fail: Greta Thunberg on activism, friendship and failing to be a 'normal' teenager
How To Fail With Elizabeth Day
The Importance of Humor and Self-Identity
In this chapter, the speaker discusses how their sense of humor often gets overlooked due to the serious nature of their activism. They talk about how people's perception of them as an angry teenager contrasts with their actual personality. They also mention their strategy of using humor to respond to critics and their group chat called the Moose Cult.
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Transcript
Episode notes
Speaker 2
God, I wish I had your brain. And I also just wish that we could clone you, although there's obviously ethical dimensions to that, and just package you up and send you into every single place of learning, just listening to you as a total education. That
Speaker 1
would benefit the carrot industry because everyone would be eating carrots, then. Would
Speaker 2
they? Do you love carrots? Yes. Okay. You need to get a carrot brand partnership. That's what we need aim
Speaker 1
for next. I could be sponsored. They could pay for all my boss cards.
Speaker 2
I love that you love carrots. Or just like shredded carrots, raw carrots, carrots. Okay. More so than cooked.
Speaker 1
Yeah. Also frozen peas. So
Speaker 2
that's off topics, but yeah. That is weird. Wait, I've totally lost my fan of thought now. No zero. That was talking
Speaker 1
about zero emissions. Yes.
Speaker 2
Okay. Is it true that no politician you've met has ever impressed you?
Speaker 1
That depends on how you define impress, but in the sense of climate action, then no, no politician has impressed me. I know that there are people who are trying from the inside to improve things. And of course, this responsibility doesn't fall on any individual to do. But we have to realize that even if they would want to act in line with the science, they would not be able to, because first of all, it wouldn't be possible in this system, as I explained earlier, but second of all, they do not have the public support for that. Since the level of awareness is so low, they could get away with basically doing anything, and people will not support these radical climate action that would be needed.
Speaker 2
Who amongst the many politicians that you've met have you liked the most?
Speaker 1
I don't know. I do have some friends who then decided to become politicians. And that feels a bit weird. But yeah, I still like you as a friend.
Speaker 2
Did you like Emmanuel Macron? You seem to get on well with him. He had a very nice dog. Did he? Yes. What kind? It was a mixed breed, but it was black. Reminded me of my dog. Okay. Well, that's probably the highest compliment you can pay, other than him giving you a carrot. That would top it, yeah. Yeah. I mean, most
Speaker 1
politicians are very friendly. That is partly why probably they got the job. So it's sometimes difficult to separate the person in their role.
Speaker 2
Yes. That's very astute. Part of what is brilliant about your latest work, the climate book, is that it puts all of the science in one place. You've collated the work of extraordinary experts in various different fields and Margaret Atwood, I might add. And you write these introductions to each chapter, which are written in your beautiful and impassioned and clear style.
Speaker 1
Do you think
Speaker 2
part of the difficulty is that we live in an age where we distrust experts, where our politicians have taught us not only to distrust experts, but to distrust the truth. We almost live in a post-truth society.
Speaker 1
I would definitely say that we live in a post-truth society. Unfortunately, of course, that's just my interpretation. But yeah, because it does feel like everything has to be up for debate. If someone says that we need to face out fossil fuels immediately, we need someone else to weigh up and say that no, that's bad for the economy. Even if it's black and white, the climate crisis is an existential threat. If we're having a debate, we need someone else to go on. But what about jobs? Completely ignoring the fact that we would be creating more jobs with a sustainable transition. But because truth doesn't matter, anyone can just say whatever they want. It's not a question about who is right or who makes most sense. It's just who can scream the loudest, who can convince you with the easiest conclusions, the easiest arguments, so that you don't have to think for yourself. You don't have to do anything yourself. You just being fed this already processed arguments. Yeah, we
Speaker 2
have a new king here in the United Kingdom. I wonder whether you have met him because he is someone who asked the Prince of Wales, spoke a lot about the damage being done to our climate.
Speaker 1
I think I have met him.
Speaker 2
This is such a flex. You can't remember.
Speaker 1
I can't keep track of the British Royal family. They are so many.
Speaker 2
I love you. That was the best response ever. You've probably met him. I think you've met Prince William probably because of the earth's shot prize and his friends with Jane Goodall.
Speaker 1
I don't know.
Speaker 2
They all merge into one. I hear you. Sorry if I offended anyone. Let's get on to your third and final failure, which is that you fail to take anything seriously in private. In your words, this means I don't care what people think and I am happier. I was so happy to read this failure of yours because I've worried about you. You've been through so much and so many personal attacks from people old enough to know better. Tell us how you got to this point of being able not to take anything too seriously.
Speaker 1
I don't know. I just guess that's just who I am as a person. So many times people have said that aren't you afraid when they see me on the streets? I thought you would have bodyguards and stuff. And then I'm like, maybe I should take this more seriously than I do. Just now I saw a letter because people send letters to my family because they think I did it. I saw one who had sent a picture of me as a target and I just started laughing because it was really funny.
Speaker 2
Which is thank God. It's
Speaker 1
like that and not the opposite because if I would have actually listened to everything people say and if I would have taken it seriously, I don't think it would have been possible. Also when it comes to the climate crisis, I mean don't get me wrong. I take it very very seriously. That is why I spend all of my time fighting against it. But to a certain extent you cannot take in more than what you already do. If you're doing everything you can to prevent something from happening, you have to try at least to not spend all your time worrying about it. I've done that many many years ago and I am sort of past that. I know that things are bad. I know that everything is going the wrong direction it seems like. So what I can do is try to eat carrots and just do my best.
Speaker 2
Yes eat carrots and stroke dogs. Do your parents worry when they get letters
Speaker 1
like that? Yeah I mean I think so. I think they do. I mean it's reasonable to believe that they would. I think they have seen me in a state that I think they are more worried that I would be worried about it than actually something happening.
Speaker 2
Okay. Will you tell us about your Twitter biography strategy? Because it is one of the funniest reposts to trolling I have ever seen. And it went on for a bit. So tell us what happened with Donald Trump and your Twitter biography and also the president of Brazil. There's been so many times I don't really remember exactly which ones but
Speaker 1
there have been several locations where a certain president or of some country has said something not intended to make me feel good but rather intended to intimidate or mock me and then I've used that against them. For example the president of Brazil if he says I'm a brat then I say brat in my Twitter biography. Yeah.
Speaker 2
I've actually got the quotes here. So Donald Trump tweeted about you in an attempt at irony a very bad attempt. She seems like a very happy young girl looking forward to bright and wonderful features. So nice to see Exclamation Bank. And you reacted by changing your Twitter bio to match his description stating that you couldn't understand why grown-ups would choose to mock children and teenagers for just communicating and acting on the science when they could be doing something good instead. But then President Trump mocked you after being named person of the year by Time magazine tweeting so ridiculous Greta Moss work on her anger management problem then go to a good old fashion movie with a friend. Chill Greta Trill. You responded by changing your Twitter biography too. A teenager working on her anger management problem currently chilling and watching a good old fashion movie with a friend. And when the 2020 US presidential election was happening Trump was tweeting stop the count. And you replied so ridiculous Donald Moss work on his anger management problem then go to a good old fashion movie with a friend. Chill Donald Chill. Yeah
Speaker 1
I would never attack an individual but if they are attacking me first then I'm just showing what they are saying back at them. So
Speaker 2
yeah. Yes. And you have a great sense of humor which I think can sometimes get lost in the urgent seriousness of what you do but you're really funny.
Speaker 1
I don't know. I'm having fun at least. It's quite funny to see people. Their idea of me is that angry teenager who screams at world leaders. It's fun because if you have met me in person it's like it's complete opposites. It's actually very funny to see. In Twitter profiles when someone says something to me for example on text or something I could just write to them for example in the group chat in the fifth Sweden we have a spam chat called the Moose Cult and then I could just write like look at my Twitter bio and then the same go like oh no have you changed it again. And then it's like something really really crazy and sometimes it's very not appropriate. And then they see it and we like haha and then I change it very quickly before anyone sees.
Speaker 2
Oh I see. So it's a strategy now. Okay and you also said after cop 26 when you were criticized for swearing which is ridiculous that you went net zero on swear words which also name you laugh. So is that the secret then to being able to cope with the nature of these personal attacks is that you have a group of people the Moose Cult who know who you are and that's who you turn to. Or yeah and do you have practical strategies? Do you mute people? Do you put your phone on airplane mode and say I'm not going to look at any social media? How do you cope on a very practical level? I
Speaker 1
mean I have my phone on airplane mode all the time that's just because I get too many notifications unless I'm like actively working with it. I use social media to like upload strike picture every week. But other than that I open social media maybe once every three days or something. So I don't actually look at it which maybe I should because I should be more up because I don't know. I have no idea what's happening there apart from like when people send me things like oh here's some of the conspiracy theory about you and so on. I don't actually look at it and sometimes I find myself like scrolling through like comment section but then I'm like within three seconds I'm like why am I doing this and then turning it off because I don't have
Speaker 2
time for that. Yeah I love that the only way you will ever use an airplane Greta Thunberg is in the airplane mode on your phone. We can be grateful for that. I do love the
Speaker 1
airplane mode it's so good. So
Speaker 2
do I. And just going back to that idea that you get your sense of self from the people who know you is that important to you and sort of coping with this level of global fame.
Speaker 1
I do think it's important to distinguish this is this person and that is that person otherwise you would get lost I think because I mean there was a time where I actually looked at what people were saying about Friday's future and so on and it was just like one second I was a communist and the next second I was a super capitalist and these complete opposites people are saying all the time one second I was a manipulative child the next second my parents were the ones manipulating me and so on so it was like I'd have no idea what's happening. How do
Speaker 2
you feel about fame?
Speaker 1
It does make it easier to get a message across. It gives me a platform that I could use to try to to spread awareness and so on and then also sometimes I get free food at restaurants but that's another aspect of it that's not as important but it
Speaker 2
is also important. No I'm just kidding
Speaker 1
but yeah I could never have imagined that doing activism would lead to that because being famous and being an activist aren't words or at least it didn't used to be words that were synonymous but it does make it weird because if I'm organizing at a grassroots level that's a completely different world and then someone like a president can invite me to a palace and then they could be like a world celebrity that wants to hang out and thus these three worlds and that I'm in school these worlds are not in any way the same they have nothing in common it's fun but it sometimes takes energy to switch between them but I do not enjoy being in the spotlight. How do
Speaker 2
you feel when people ask you for
Speaker 1
selfies? It depends what mood I am in sometimes they say like are you going to the thumb? I say no sometimes I just say yes and just like you know I don't have time to argue and then sometimes when they say are you going to the thumb and then I say no I'm her evil twin I have many like such phrases I use just to make things a bit more fun because otherwise it gets too boring like are you going to the thumb? No you and these things sometimes when I'm like please someone just help us do things I'm like can I take a selfie with you only if you come to the strike next week and then they're like yes of course I won't then never do
Speaker 2
but you've tried yes so I know that you are very good at staying in the present moment but if you'll indulge me I'm going to ask this question anyway if you can imagine yourself as an 85 year old woman what is 85 year old Greta Thunberg doing? Where is she living and who is she with?
Speaker 1
I hope that she is with animals I hope that she is with the ones she loves I hope that she is knitting a lot I'm doing that already but I just hope that 85 year old me is doing it even more I want to become one of these old ladies who are not silent and who don't accept injustices like I know there are many today that are really inspiring and that I look up to and that I want to be like when I'm
Speaker 2
older that is such a perfect answer surrounded by carrot fields
Speaker 1
yeah I should throw my own carrots
Speaker 2
yes this podcast is all about failure and also about what we learn from failure but what for you is success do you think how would you define success in your life
Speaker 1
it depends if it's on a personal level or if it's on a global level I'd love
Speaker 2
to start with the personal level mm-hmm
Speaker 1
success for me is well-being I think many people who come up to me and my parents and and like so and like you must be so proud and then I'm like no why would I because I was raised with this kind of idea that pride doesn't mean anything as long as you are happy as long as you are doing well as long as you are feeling well you shouldn't owe anyone to have to do something to have to prove yourself and to make someone else proud or to make yourself proud you so success for me is just being happy and doing something I want to do doing something that I feel is meaningful for
Speaker 2
me and on a global level as
Speaker 1
we talked about earlier we can't really expect any concrete improvements right now because it's impossible of course that doesn't mean that while we are waiting for this sort of mass movement to be created while we are waiting for this system change that hopefully will come that doesn't mean that we shouldn't in that time do everything we can as the role of individuals businesses politicians scientists communicators etc that doesn't mean that we should do our very best to do everything we possibly can but it does mean that we cannot really be satisfied until we have achieved the real big changes
Speaker 2
Greta tunberg I can't myself so lucky to live in an age where you exist and to have got to speak to you today is genuinely one of the privileges of my professional life I'm so moved by you but I'm also so informed by you and this has been a great deal of fun on top of that and I cannot thank you enough for coming on how to fail well I
Speaker 1
mean thank you I really enjoyed this and thank you so much yeah it's been really lovely
Speaker 2
if you enjoyed this episode of how to fail with Elizabeth day I would so appreciate it if you could rate review and subscribe apparently it helps other people know that we exist
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