Speaker 4
We know Israel from the taxis. Right. But but he happened to be good. And what
Speaker 3
he was saying was, look, the other day, Arab slipped into an army base and stole a tractor. Whoever heard of such a thing happening in the state of Israel. We have no security left anymore. They throw stones at soldiers and soldiers. Don't respond. I'd like to see that happen in Putin's Russia. In other words, look, you can't argue with that because it's part of a much larger
Speaker 1
psychological framework that you just described. I think this psychological I've been thinking about
Speaker 3
this. Democracy is a luxury. It's a luxury. Now, I the only disagreement that I have with the way you laid it out was some people in the Netanyahu camp tend not to give people in the liberal camp the benefit of the doubt that we're all interested in protecting Israel. What you hear more and more in the nationalist Netanyahu camp is they don't care about Israeli security. They are willing to sacrifice us for their high ideals. That's the discourse that I find so worrying. So worry. There's
Speaker 1
another, if I could put another one, and I think maybe it contributes, you know, it's interesting when there is a psychological motivation, because it would also explain why there is no change. We're fixed. You move in your block. You're not going to move outside your block no matter what you do because it just doesn't count. It's
Speaker 3
deeper than just tribal divides. We always talk about the tribal divide. There's a psychological divide. You see,
Speaker 1
but I think the psychological divides are even being fed by the tribe. They're like, I think they're combining because I can even look at this latest Israel signing a deal with Lebanon to recognize its borders so that
Speaker 3
we're going to the maritime borders and we're going
Speaker 1
to agree and we're going to have our oil, the gas thing, and they'll have their gas thing. Frankly, you asked me, is it a
Speaker 4
good deal or a bad? I have no idea. I didn't look into it. I didn't study the issue to know like, did Israel get a good deal or not? I'm just assuming, this is a good
Speaker 1
thing. You know, we're living in an era of, in Hebrew, you call it, chef of abundance. And we're now,
Speaker 4
we have a major amount and we're going to get another major amount of gas. And
Speaker 1
we're in doing so. We're also going to not have conflict with our neighbor and Lebanon. So like, I'm not worried about the exact deal. Like, I'm not like, and then all this, all the other side, this is the mere fact that you've negotiated a deal. You've sold the shop. They got 100%. This is the former American ambassador of David Friedman.
Speaker 4
Israel got zero and the Lebanese got 100% and and oh,
Speaker 1
and Nasserala is happy because if Nasserala is happy by definition, I, you start from a place that that everything our world is about to fall apart. And here you're doing it again.
Speaker 4
You just destroyed and I come from that other place.
Speaker 1
So there is that. And that's why
Speaker 4
you can't even talk with each other. But when you lay on top of it,
Speaker 1
Israel is a very deeply tribal society. And when this psychological propensity sits on tribal identities, it becomes even more ingrained because even if I'm not as fearful, my tribe is supposed to be fearful.
Speaker 3
You know, so, you know, and it's an extraordinary moment in Israel because we're now in round five in three years of elections and nothing's moving. No amount of argument. It's not about argument. It's not about policy. No, no. And you look at this government, the way it's performed in the last year, look at each ministry and compare it to the way the ministries were being run in the last few years. We've have a well-functioning government just on that basis. It doesn't matter because if you feel that the country's security is being threatened, if it's a question of life and death, it doesn't matter to me if Merav Mihaili is doing a good job in trans- You know, it's
Speaker 1
also a sequence. And that, by the way, is why Benvir is so powerful. And why Benvir is not just a member of a coalition, but he's defining the tenor of a coalition. Yes, yes. Yes. Because when he gets up and says, this coalition, and this is the language, has endangered the state of Israel. We have no government over the Negev.