Heretics, science, and changing your mind

In this powerful full-length conversation, Chris Packham joins Andrew Gold for one of the most challenging and revealing interviews of his career. 

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Watch Chris Packham's important film here: https://youtu.be/XjWUKFUaoL4

Follow him on X: https://x.com/ChrisGPackham

 Across a wide-ranging discussion, they dive into some of the most divisive issues in the UK today — from the BBC’s impartiality to woke culture, transgender debates, multiculturalism, migration, and the future of our society.

Chris makes a passionate case for the value of an independent BBC, defending public broadcasting and pushing back on claims that it has been overtaken by progressive ideology. Andrew presents the counterargument, questioning whether woke culture, cancel culture, and narrowing viewpoints have created an unbalanced media landscape.

The episode takes a deeper turn as they explore the trans conversation, with Chris emphasising empathy and tolerance while Andrew raises concerns about underreported stories, regret, and editorial responsibility. From there, they tackle immigration vs migration, the humanitarian crises driving movement across borders, and whether multiculturalism genuinely benefits modern Britain.

This is not a clash — it’s a rare, honest examination of how two people with different worldviews can challenge each other, listen, and still find common ground. Thought-provoking, uncomfortable, and refreshing in equal measure, this episode is essential viewing for anyone interested in free speech, media accountability, political culture, social change, and the future of public debate.

Watch to the end for Chris’s urgent message about the greatest threat facing humanity — and why we’re distracted from it.

#ChrisPackham #AndrewGold #WokeDebate 

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