Navigating Fiscal Policy and the Impact of Technological Growth

Today on Upstream, Erik Torenberg and Noah Smith discuss the Abundance Agenda by Ezra Klein and Derek Thompson, the impact of the 2008 recession, Obama's presidency, and shifts in political ideology, focusing on the 'New Right' and its cultural and economic implications, while also touching upon the economic recovery strategies post-2008.

This episode originally aired on Econ102 (April 1, 2025)

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LINKS:

Noahpinion: https://www.noahpinion.blog/

Abundance (by Ezra Klein and Derek Thompson): https://www.amazon.com/Abundance-Progress-Takes-Ezra-Klein/dp/1668023482 

The Clash of Civilizations (by Samuel Huntington): https://www.amazon.com/Clash-Civilizations-Remaking-World-Order/dp/1451628978 

Revolt of the Public (by Martin Gurri): https://www.amazon.com/Revolt-Public-Crisis-Authority-Millennium/dp/1732265143 

Understanding America's New Right: https://www.noahpinion.blog/p/understanding-americas-new-right 

American Factory: https://www.netflix.com/title/81090071 

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HIGHLIGHTS FROM THE EPISODE:

• The "abundance agenda" is gaining unexpected traction among Democrats who see it as a unifying message rather than class warfare.
• Noah views the abundance agenda as appealing because it promises prosperity for all Americans regardless of political beliefs.
• Noah considers Obama underrated, highlighting his stimulus package, Dodd-Frank regulations, Iraq War withdrawal, and Obamacare.
• Obama's immigration policy focused on deporting criminal elements, reducing the illegal immigrant population by about a million.
• The 2008 financial crisis was a "liquidity preference shock" where fear caused everyone to hold cash rather than spend.
• During demand-side crises, the government acts as "spender of last resort" to jumpstart economic activity.
• Infrastructure spending during the Obama era wasn't efficient, creating problems for future building initiatives.
• Post-2008 policies increased US debt from 60% to 100% of GDP during Obama's administration.
• Higher inflation under Biden has actually decreased the debt-to-GDP ratio despite increased spending.
• The "new right" ideology focuses on "Western civilization" - not racial nationalism but reverence for traditional European/Christian heritage.
• New right politicians like JD Vance care more about "meme wars" and online status than practical policy solutions.
• Social media has empowered a small percentage of politically active "shouting class" with outsized influence.