Caleb's stuff is really kind of Lovecraftian i think right you know because he's really figured in his conversation about the data home precisely how in a quantifiable way the pressure of the institutions and systems that have emerged through our interactions are placing a burden on our behavior. Our cultural inheritance grows richer and and deeper by the day by the moment yeah so let's just end now with i mean it's personal for you because you've recently had not that recently but your children and um and in fact personal for me in other ways because of my interest in noise  and a recent debate that David Wilpert and i had with Danny canaman and tasan sine and others where we

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