Reviving Educational Leadership | 4min snip from Chalk & Talk

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A decade of decline: Examining falling test scores with Mike Petrilli (Ep 45)

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CHAPTER

Reviving Educational Leadership

This chapter explores the current challenges in U.S. educational policy, highlighting the lack of presidential commitment to education. The speakers reflect on the importance of education as a transformative force and express hope for future leadership to prioritize it once again.

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Episode notes

In this episode, host and math professor Anna Stokke interviews Mike Petrilli, President of the Thomas B. Fordham Institute, about the role of standardized testing in K–12 education. They discuss the benefits and criticisms of standardized tests, the methodologies behind tests like NAEP, international comparisons with PISA and TIMSS, long-term trends in student performance, and the consequences of declines in student achievement.

Highlights include a discussion of Mississippi's educational success despite high poverty rates, and the potential influences of modern educational policies and smartphones. Mike Petrilli emphasizes the importance of accurate measurement for policymaking and shares advice on influencing educational policy. This episode is a must-listen for educators, policymakers, parents, and anyone interested in the future of education.

FREE WEBINAR: The Science of Math Instruction: Using Evidence-Based Practices in the Classroom, May 8, 2025. Registration link: https://home.edweb.net/webinar/mathskills20250508/

TIMESTAMPS

[00:00:00] Introduction

[00:03:18] Discussion on standardized testing

[00:06:14] Criticisms of standardized testing

[00:12:25] Frequency and levels of testing

[00:20:04] International perspectives on testing

[00:23:11] Understanding NAEP

[00:28:07] Recent trends in NAEP scores

[00:28:41] Impact of the pandemic

[00:31:16] Pre-pandemic declines

[00:32:26] Comparing international trends: PISA scores

[00:33:08] The role of smartphones