Defining the Old World Order

Bret Stephens contrasts postwar rules-based diplomacy with recent power politics and gives historical parallels to U.S. interventions.

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Today’s Episode:

Few people expected to start 2026 with images of Nicolas Maduro in a New York prison. In the days since Madouro’s capture, many have argued that the Trump administration’s operation in Venezuela is another signal that the global system we’ve known for the better part of a century has dramatically changed. From the ongoing Russia-Ukraine war, to Israel’s two-year multifront battle, to a potential Chinese invasion of Taiwan, geopolitical power dynamics are rapidly shifting. But to what end? Are we witnessing the emergence of a new world order?

To discuss the historical context and implications of the geopolitical moment we find ourselves in, Dan was joined by Call me Back veteran Brett Stephens. Brett is an opinion columnist for the New York Times, a senior contributor to NBC News, and the inaugural editor in chief of the Sapir journal. Bret previously worked as a foreign affairs columnist for the Wall Street Journal, and from 2002-2004 served as the editor in chief of the Jerusalem Post.

(00:00) Introduction

(05:32) Unpacking the “old world order”

(13:43) Where does Europe stand?

(16:55) What Europe could learn from Israel

(19:11) The Middle East and Turkey’s growing influence

(22:32) What to make of the mass protests in Iran

(25:12) The illusion of a rules-based global order?

(27:16) Trump: what he gets right and what he gets wrong

(32:28) Are we heading toward a great power war?

CREDITS:

ILAN BENATAR - Producer & Editor

ADAAM JAMES LEVIN-AREDDY - Executive Producer