I got into building iOS apps right when the iPad came out. I made a few apps that started making a couple thousand dollars a month in the App Store. And so then in late 2011, the startup we were at, like they'd raised a whole bunch of money. They'd raised 36 million, which for Boise at that time was a certain amount of money. So it's like, I still have a job, but it's time to go. He went out on his own, did freelance iOS design for a while. In 2012, he wrote a book called The App Design Handbook. That was self published and sold $400,000 or $500,000 over three years.