Prison Break

The book is about how conservatives convinced other conservatives that the problems of the criminal justice system were identity appropriate for them to address. It's a kind of janis faced book, and that it's got a message that's not exactly traditionally comfortable for both the left and the right. We're making an argument that concern about inequality is entirely consistent with other identity commitments that people on the right have. To the left, we are arguing that lots of inequaliti is produced by government. And if you care about inequality, you can't just talk about inequality as a problem. That's a problem of markets, arn't you have to think of it as a problem of government.

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As the old nut goes, “To the victor goes the spoils.” But if each round of play consolidates the spoils into fewer hands, eventually it comes to pass that wealthy special interests twist the rules so much it undermines the game itself. When economic power overtakes the processes of democratic governance, growth stagnates, and the rift between the rich and poor becomes abyssal. Desperate times and desperate measures jeopardize the fabric of society. How might nonpartisan approaches to this wicked problem help us walk the system back into a healthy balance?

Welcome to COMPLEXITY, the official podcast of the Santa Fe Institute. I’m your host, Michael Garfield, and every other week we’ll bring you with us for far-ranging conversations with our worldwide network of rigorous researchers developing new frameworks to explain the deepest mysteries of the universe.

This week on Complexity we speak with Steven Teles, political scientist at Johns Hopkins University and SFI External Professor Rajiv Sethi, Professor of Economics at Barnard College, Columbia University about how self-serving economic actors intervene in regulation to stifle innovation, increase inequality, and contribute to the conditions in which violence can flourish. Referencing Teles’ aisle-crossing book The Captured Economy with co-author Brink Lindsey, we link the problem of regulatory capture in its myriad forms to Sethi’s work on race, inequality, and crime, which we discussed in Episode 7 (Rajiv Sethi on Crime, Stereotypes, and The Pursuit of Justice). At the interface between the left and right, public and private, our guests shed light on the forces that divide — and may help reunite — the USA and other modern nations.

Be sure to check out our extensive show notes with links to all our references at complexity.simplecast.com. Note that applications are now open for our Complexity Postdoctoral Fellowships! Tell a friend. And if you value our research and communication efforts, please subscribe, rate and review us at Apple Podcasts or Spotify, and consider making a donation — or finding other ways to engage with us — at santafe.edu/engage.

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Podcast theme music by Mitch Mignano.

More on the Emergent Political Economies SFI Research Theme:

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Complexity 82 - David Krakauer on Emergent Political Economies and A Science of Possibility (EPE 01)

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Complexity 84 - Ricardo Hausmann & J. Doyne Farmer on Evolving Technologies & Market Ecologies (EPE 03)

Referenced in (or related to) this episode:

The Captured Economy: How The Powerful Enrich Themselves, Slow Down Growth, and Increase Inequality
by Brink Lindsey and Steven Teles

Shadows of Doubt: Stereotypes, Crime, and the Pursuit of Justice
by Brendan O’Flaherty and Rajiv Sethi

Complexity 19 - David B. Kinney on the Philosophy of Science