How I Found the ICCE and How It Affects My Life

How did you come to do this kind of work with the ICCE? Yeah I think for me it's I think the year is 2004 and I'm just scouting around looking for stuff that might be interesting. Everybody was talking about a model specific type of treatment which was so different from what I've seen and read from Scott and other colleagues work. So we went on to pursue research in this area and then we took it a little bit further with trainings that we do annually in Chicago and then now this book which has been seeded many many years prior.