Steve Ballmer, Microsoft’s CEO from 2000 to 2014, was instrumental in scaling the company from a small 30-person startup to one of the most valuable companies on the planet. Ahead of Microsoft’s 50th anniversary, I had the chance to catch up with my former boss. We talked about the early days of Microsoft and the pitch that convinced him to take a chance on a small company in a new industry. We also discussed how three traits—irrational confidence, realism, and persistence—have helped him succeed at Microsoft and today as the owner of the LA Clippers.

Click here for the episode transcript.