Eric and Christian talk about the use of trama in everyday language. They say it's possible to acknowledge note and soothe distress without needing to legitimize it by assigning it the tram label. And that if we do too much of this assigning of trama to things that maybe aren't, quote, "onquoe trama" they decrease our psychological flexibility and resiliency. The pair also discuss their new book 'Terrifying Torms', which is out now.

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