381 - James Orr - Christianity Beyond Civilization
The Symbolic World
00:00
Intro
This chapter explores the contrasting endings of northern mythology's Ragnarok and the Christian narrative of Revelation, highlighting themes of chaos, death, and eternal glory. It emphasizes the importance of self-sacrifice and suggests that true fulfillment comes from giving oneself, rather than the pursuit of fleeting power and wealth.
Transcript
Play full episode
Transcript
Episode notes
I had a wonderful discussion with James Orr. Dr Orr is Associate Professor of Philosophy of Religion at the Faculty of Divinity at the University of Cambridge. He was also one of the panel members for the Daily Wire Plus Exodus and Gospels seminars, which we discuss in this video. We also talk about our difference approaches and perspectives on Scripture, the current cultural shift and Christianity becoming more mainstream, the risk of instrumentalizing Christianity, Paul Kingsnorth's talk "Against Christian Civilization", and more.
Watch the Gospel Seminar on Daily Wire Plus: https://www.dailywire.com/show/the-gospels
My discussion with Paul Kingsnorth, Western Civilization Is Already Dead: https://youtu.be/FrjdaVol2TA?si=D6A3mm3WXj5f2i4W
Paul Kingsnorth’s First Things talk: "Against Christian Civilization" | 2024 Erasmus Lecture: https://www.youtube.com/live/Y3hMSZqatHI
James Orr links:
- https://www.divinity.cam.ac.uk/directory/dr-james-orr
- https://x.com/jtworr
=====================
NEW COURSE: The Symbolic World Goes to Middle-Earth
Join us for an in-depth study of J.R.R. Tolkien’s Legendarium, where we'll explore his masterful use of medieval literary genres, Christian storytelling traditions, and hidden philology. This course, presented by Richard Rohlin, will guide you through Tolkien's vision for a "Mythology for England," examining his work as a complex tapestry of Universal History. Through this journey, we’ll also examine Tolkien’s use of epic poems, chronicles, and literary devices to craft a truly legendary vision of the past, present, and future. Thereafter, we'll look at how his work has inspired later authors of fantasy, shaped the genre more generally, and continues to aid our recovery of deeper, cosmological storytelling. - Dates: Live classes are on Mondays at 1 PM Central starting March 3, 2025 - Course length: 5 weeks, 10 hours of lectures - Cost: $150 - 10% Discount for all patrons at the Involved tier or higher, apply your discount code at checkout - Participants will be given access to lesson recordings with downloadable audio - You’ll also have the opportunity to apply these ideas to contemporary authors and your own mythopoeic writing! - The course is hosted on the Symbolic World Circle Community platform. Sign up as a free member at https://www.thesymbolicworld.com/join-community before making your purchase.
Register today: https://www.thesymbolicworld.com/courses/tolkien-and-universal-history =====================
Timestamps:
00:00 - Coming up
00:47 - Intro music
01:11 - Introduction
01:57 - James' reaction to The Gospels seminar
05:04 - JBP mediating the panel discussion
09:25 - Members of the panel
11:55 - Approaching Scripture from different perspectives
15:23 - James' scholarly approach vs Jonathan's analogical approach
20:37 - A time of flux
28:18 - Paul Kingsnorth's First Things address
32:44 - Instrumentalizing Christianity
38:52 - Self-sacrificial love
41:39 - Recognize weaponized compassion
43:11 - Fetishizing weakness?
48:22 - The end of the story
51:34 - Technology
54:45 - New people coming to church
💻 Website and blog: http://www.thesymbolicworld.com
🔗 Linktree: https://linktr.ee/jonathanpageau
🗣 Join The Symbolic World Community for discussions about symbolism: https://thesymbolicworld.com/subscribe
🔒 BECOME A PATRON: https://thesymbolicworld.com/subscribe
📱 SOCIAL MEDIA
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/TheSymbolicWorld
Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/pageaujonathan
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/jonathan.pageau
Our website designers: https://www.resonancehq.io/
My intro was arranged and recorded by Matthew Wilkinson: https://matthewwilkinson.net/
Watch the Gospel Seminar on Daily Wire Plus: https://www.dailywire.com/show/the-gospels
My discussion with Paul Kingsnorth, Western Civilization Is Already Dead: https://youtu.be/FrjdaVol2TA?si=D6A3mm3WXj5f2i4W
Paul Kingsnorth’s First Things talk: "Against Christian Civilization" | 2024 Erasmus Lecture: https://www.youtube.com/live/Y3hMSZqatHI
James Orr links:
- https://www.divinity.cam.ac.uk/directory/dr-james-orr
- https://x.com/jtworr
=====================
NEW COURSE: The Symbolic World Goes to Middle-Earth
Join us for an in-depth study of J.R.R. Tolkien’s Legendarium, where we'll explore his masterful use of medieval literary genres, Christian storytelling traditions, and hidden philology. This course, presented by Richard Rohlin, will guide you through Tolkien's vision for a "Mythology for England," examining his work as a complex tapestry of Universal History. Through this journey, we’ll also examine Tolkien’s use of epic poems, chronicles, and literary devices to craft a truly legendary vision of the past, present, and future. Thereafter, we'll look at how his work has inspired later authors of fantasy, shaped the genre more generally, and continues to aid our recovery of deeper, cosmological storytelling. - Dates: Live classes are on Mondays at 1 PM Central starting March 3, 2025 - Course length: 5 weeks, 10 hours of lectures - Cost: $150 - 10% Discount for all patrons at the Involved tier or higher, apply your discount code at checkout - Participants will be given access to lesson recordings with downloadable audio - You’ll also have the opportunity to apply these ideas to contemporary authors and your own mythopoeic writing! - The course is hosted on the Symbolic World Circle Community platform. Sign up as a free member at https://www.thesymbolicworld.com/join-community before making your purchase.
Register today: https://www.thesymbolicworld.com/courses/tolkien-and-universal-history =====================
Timestamps:
00:00 - Coming up
00:47 - Intro music
01:11 - Introduction
01:57 - James' reaction to The Gospels seminar
05:04 - JBP mediating the panel discussion
09:25 - Members of the panel
11:55 - Approaching Scripture from different perspectives
15:23 - James' scholarly approach vs Jonathan's analogical approach
20:37 - A time of flux
28:18 - Paul Kingsnorth's First Things address
32:44 - Instrumentalizing Christianity
38:52 - Self-sacrificial love
41:39 - Recognize weaponized compassion
43:11 - Fetishizing weakness?
48:22 - The end of the story
51:34 - Technology
54:45 - New people coming to church
💻 Website and blog: http://www.thesymbolicworld.com
🔗 Linktree: https://linktr.ee/jonathanpageau
🗣 Join The Symbolic World Community for discussions about symbolism: https://thesymbolicworld.com/subscribe
🔒 BECOME A PATRON: https://thesymbolicworld.com/subscribe
📱 SOCIAL MEDIA
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/TheSymbolicWorld
Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/pageaujonathan
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/jonathan.pageau
Our website designers: https://www.resonancehq.io/
My intro was arranged and recorded by Matthew Wilkinson: https://matthewwilkinson.net/
The AI-powered Podcast Player
Save insights by tapping your headphones, chat with episodes, discover the best highlights - and more!
