The Relationship Between Craft and Leadership

Sally Kohn: I want to go back to craft. You talked to Jorge about the importance of craft, you're reveling in Figma and as you say those things, I get nervous. Now I'm not a proper design leader anymore, I've become some form of management consultant but if I were to go back and become a VP of design, I haven't opened a design tool in 10 to 15 years apart from keynote. Any design that I do, I do in keynote. And at least for me, the craft that I aspire to at this stage in my career has to do with helping design leaders manifest and make tangible these very vague, hard to pin down complex,