Pop-up shops, clever T-shirts, and made-up holidays — all in the name of keeping indie books alive.

In this episode of The Way Up, Guy Raz sits down with Pete Mulvihill, co-owner of San Francisco’s iconic Green Apple Books. While big-box retailers dominate the market, Pete and his team have kept their independent bookstore thriving for decades by thinking way outside the box. From airports to bakeries, Pete shares the creativity, strategy, and community focus that keeps the shelves stocked and the doors open.

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