It's often very hard to know what companies are doing right by their workers. I was just in London and there's some signs on the windows of London that say, you know, this store pays a living wage. We're often not shopping or investing according to our economic justice values. And I would like to see us do more of that.
RUFUS GRISCOM: Could you share with us your broader mission and how your new book, “Poverty, by America,” supports that mission?
MATTHEW DESMOND: I want to end poverty. I want to be part of the movement that’s growing around the country not to treat it but to cure it, not to reduce it but to abolish it. And I say that because we can. We can, as a country, put an end to all this scarcity and deprivation in our midst.