Kina gets back to what sabina was saying in her book about sort of the lack of advances in 50 years. So where is that? Where is that fine line? Like socafe, you apportion your confidence based on the evidence available. I think if you've spent a big portion of your life researching a particular idea that you're fond of, and then the evidence doesn't come forward as readily as you thought it would, there's conflicting evidence.

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