The Active Voice: E. Jean Carroll, Mary Trump and Jen Taub are bringing serialization into the mainstream
The Active Voice
How to Explain Sub-Sac to People
Sub-sac is a newsletter and people have their own websites on this platform called sub-sac with which they can do whatever they want. A lot of people in the publishing world are watching what we're doing, says author Sarah J. Maas. "I think there's something I've noticed: If you look to my office, there are not just books in a neatly lined up"
Today’s episode is guest-hosted by Sarah Fay, creative writing professor at Northwestern University, former interviewer at The Paris Review, devoted serializer, and lover of all things Substack. Her Substack Writers at Work helps creative writers use Substack to bolster their careers, including how to serialize their writing. She’s currently serializing her new memoir Cured on Substack through 2023.
—Sophia Efthimiatou, Head of Writer Relations
**
You may recognize the names of today’s guests: Mary Trump, E. Jean Carroll, and Jennifer Taub. Their new venture is a groundbreaking Substack: Backstory Serial. The content may surprise you—though it shouldn’t, and I’ll explain why during the podcast. Backstory Serial features their romance novel The Italian Lesson, which is bringing serial novels and Substack fiction into the mainstream.
The Italian Lesson is a serialization, meaning it appears in your inbox, chapter by chapter, installment by installment. The plot of The Italian Lesson is simple: An American woman moves to a small town in Tuscany and opens a café. Then, as Mary put it in an interview, “some stud walks in and turns out he’s a prince.”
Serialization has a long tradition on Substack—I guide writers on how to do it on my Substack, Writers at Work—but no one has had the success that these three have and there are very good reasons why, which we’ll go into.
The three women play different roles in the writing of the novel: Mary is the author, E. Jean fields comments from their vibrant community and plays the role of romance-novel fact-checker, and Jen acts as editor.
In case you don’t know Mary, E. Jean, and Jen, a bit of background:
Mary Trump describes herself as a mom, writer, liberal progressive, and pro-democracy American. She’s the author of Too Much is Never Enough about her uncle (yes, that Donald Trump) and The Reckoning. Her Substack The Good in Us features her commentary on culture, politics, and music (from Tina Turner to Aimee Mann)—plus pet pictures and a community of subscribers who share her vision to use kindness and empathy to ensure that America remains a democracy.
E. Jean Carroll’s esteemed Substack, Ask E. Jean, is the longest-running advice column in American publishing. It ran in Elle Magazine until E. Jean accused Donald Trump of assault and sued him for defamation, after which Elle fired her. She’s since made Substack her home. Her wit, smarts, sass, and empathy are unrivaled. She’s also the author of the book What Do We Need Men For?—part satirical treatise in the tradition of Jonathan Swift and part rollicking narrative.
Jennifer Traub is a one-woman force against corruption in the United States. In her book, Big Dirty Money, she takes on white-collar criminals. She’s also the author of Other People’s Houses. Jen is a law professor, an activist, and the host of the Booked Up podcast. In her firey—and also fun—Substack Money & Gossip, she clarifies what the rest of us miss or don’t make sense of in the financial and legal world.
In our conversation, we talk about everything from why the media has underestimated them as novelists, how they came up with The Italian Lesson’s unique form, why they chose to serialize on Substack, knitting patterns, cocktail recipes, the email novel, and what love really is.
—Sarah Fay
https://www.backstoryserial.com/
Show notes
* Subscribe to Backstory Serial on Substack
* Find Mary Trump, Jen Taub, and E. Jean Carroll on Twitter, and Mary, Jen and E. Jean on Instagram, and listen to Jen’s podcast Booked Up with Jen Taub
* Big Dirty Money by Jennifer Taub and books by Mary L Trump
* [03:31] Writing a romance novel
[05:19] Meeting on Zoom
[07:58] Choosing to serialize
[13:20] Mary’s introduction to writing
[16:32] Building a community
[22:00] Bringing the book to life
[27:27] Collaborating together
[32:30] Subverting traditional publishing
[38:49] Ideas for the next novel
**
The Active Voice is a podcast hosted by Hamish McKenzie, featuring weekly conversations with writers about how the internet is affecting the way they live and write. It is produced by Hamish McKenzie, with audio engineering by Seven Morris, and content production by Hannah Ray. All artwork is by Joro Chen, and music is by Phelps & Munro.
This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit post.substack.com
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